346 replies to this topic

[Shakeyhands]

Criminals don't register guns. Guns that are used in crimes in Canada probably get smuggled into Canada from the States. Therefore I am against long gun registry as it makes no sense

Criminals... hilarious. Lucky we can identify who is going be a criminal.

Like the last two RCMP shootings? Like the E'Cole Polytechnique shooting?

[olpfan1]

You don't think it makes any sense to have measures that prevent the use of guns by people stricken with mental illness?

The original intent of the registry was to address the use of guns by insane people not criminals. How and why it got sidetracked into criminality is a crime, or should be.

depends what type of mental illness

and no.. It does more harm than it does good

[eyeball]

depends what type of mental illness

There's lots of types but I'm mostly referring to those that strike after all the PALS and licences and such have been issued.

and no.. It does more harm than it does good

Care to elaborate? Are the numbers of victims to small compared to the infringement of gun-owner's freedoms or something?

[olpfan1]

There's lots of types but I'm mostly referring to those that strike after all the PALS and licences and such have been issued.


Care to elaborate? Are the numbers of victims to small compared to the infringement of gun-owner's freedoms or something?

You're welcome to disagree, its just my personal opinion which isnt supported by facts.. it could be but I didnt do any research
This isn't an issue that I feel strongly as you about

[Derek L]

Criminals... hilarious. Lucky we can identify who is going be a criminal.

Like the last two RCMP shootings? Like the E'Cole Polytechnique shooting?

And how would those events been prevented by the Government having the serial numbers of those guns on file?

[Derek L]

There's lots of types but I'm mostly referring to those that strike after all the PALS and licences and such have been issued.

As we’ve danced around this issue numerous times, and have looked at the numbers of deaths associated with “legal firearms” and “licensed owners”, of which are minimal when compared to other preventable deaths within Canada, as I asked above, how will the Government having the serial numbers of said gun prevent further deaths with legal firearms………We both already know the answer….it won’t…….Of which you’ll suggest further restrictions etc……….Instead of repeating ourselves, I’ll ask you this:


Do you feel deaths associated with legal firearms will increase once the registry is gone in the next few months?

[Shakeyhands]

And how would those events been prevented by the Government having the serial numbers of those guns on file?

A valid question, I'm not positive to be honest and it's not going to work in every case.

In the latest case, the Registry I'm sure played a part as from what I understand they were there to confiscate the guns because of an earlier domestic abuse issue. Bad luck on the RCMP's part, but it sounds like they were doing the correct thing.

Of course we still don't have all the details on this one.

I may have spoken out of school on the Mayerthorpe shooting, I would have thought they knew that Roszko may have had weapons.

[eyeball]

As we’ve danced around this issue numerous times, and have looked at the numbers of deaths associated with “legal firearms” and “licensed owners”, of which are minimal when compared to other preventable deaths within Canada, as I asked above, how will the Government having the serial numbers of said gun prevent further deaths with legal firearms………We both already know the answer….it won’t…….Of which you’ll suggest further restrictions etc……….

No, I'll suggest actual gun controls, not restrictions and certainly not more paperwork.

Instead of repeating ourselves, I’ll ask you this:

Do you feel deaths associated with legal firearms will increase once the registry is gone in the next few months?

No I think they'll increase because of the epidemic of age-onset dementia that medical experts know is coming for one thing. I think this will be exacerbated by the unwillingness and reluctance of people to accept it when mental illness strikes them - due to the stigma that remains stubbornly associated with mental illness - a situation that IMO has probably worsened during and maybe even because of the acrimonious registry debate.

Edited by eyeball, 12 February 2012 - 05:46 PM.

[Derek L]

A valid question, I'm not positive to be honest and it's not going to work in every case.

In the latest case, the Registry I'm sure played a part as from what I understand they were there to confiscate the guns because of an earlier domestic abuse issue. Bad luck on the RCMP's part, but it sounds like they were doing the correct thing.

Of course we still don't have all the details on this one.

I may have spoken out of school on the Mayerthorpe shooting, I would have thought they knew that Roszko may have had weapons.

As we initially brought up the recent RCMP shooting, I still do not want to totally drag this event into the political mud, but they were exercising a search warrant for a .45ACP…….This obviously would not fall under the purview of the LGR, and it’s unfortunate that two police officers were shot, but in this instance, with prior knowledge of a restricted firearm on the premises, something obviously failed these officers…..

In this situation, like the Mayerthorpe tragedy, police officers were shot/killed and in both these instances, the LGR would not have prevented the crimes committed……..What failed the RCMP, in both cases, was a lack of training and/or procedure……

[Derek L]

No, I'll suggest actual gun controls, not restrictions and certainly not more paperwork.


No I think they'll increase because of the epidemic of age-onset dementia that medical experts know is coming for one thing. I think this will be exacerbated by the unwillingness and reluctance of people to accept it when mental illness strikes them - due to the stigma that remains stubbornly associated with mental illness - a situation that IMO has probably worsened during and maybe even because of the acrimonious registry debate.

Your opinion is noted…….When to you expect the coming deluge of deaths associated with the LGR demise? 3 months after? 3 years? 30 years?

[eyeball]

As we initially brought up the recent RCMP shooting, I still do not want to totally drag this event into the political mud, but they were exercising a search warrant for a .45ACP…….This obviously would not fall under the purview of the LGR, and it’s unfortunate that two police officers were shot, but in this instance, with prior knowledge of a restricted firearm on the premises, something obviously failed these officers…..

In this situation, like the Mayerthorpe tragedy, police officers were shot/killed and in both these instances, the LGR would not have prevented the crimes committed……..What failed the RCMP, in both cases, was a lack of training and/or procedure……

I get the sense that what also may have failed the police in this case was the politics of gun freedom.

...others in Sedgewick paint a different picture of Brad Clarke, describing him as an imposing man with “attitude,” who always carried a handgun on his hip.

Read more: http://www.edmontonj...l#ixzz1mDeWMOH6

[Derek L]

I get the sense that what also may have failed the police in this case was the politics of gun freedom.

Funny how you bring up the one negative quote from “unnamed sources”, but fail to mention all the remaining ones that paint the suspect in a positive or neutral light, well giving their names……

Allyn Bonnett said he doesn’t believe the family, or his friend Brad, could have been involved.

“Knowing his folks and knowing him, it just doesn’t fit the bill,” said Bonnett, who described Clarke as quiet, polite, and pleasant.

“If I’d have seen him with a gun in his hands, I still would have gone to talk to him.”

Sedgewick Mayor Helen Whitten said she has known the Clarke family all her life.

“My heart goes out to the wounded, to the Mounties and their families, and, honestly, it goes out to everyone involved,” she said. “I’m really concerned about the Clarke family, the extended family.”

Debbie Swainson, a close neighbour of the Clarkes, said she rarely sees them away from their property, and hasn’t seen Brad Clarke for several years.

“You may meet them on the road, but, you know, it doesn’t happen that often,” she said.

[eyeball]

Your opinion is noted…….When to you expect the coming deluge of deaths associated with the LGR demise? 3 months after? 3 years? 30 years?

I don't think it will be a deluge or that the demise of the LGR will have much if anything to do with it.

I do think however there will be an increase in gun deaths due to mental illness, because there is going to be more mental illness in the future and probably more guns too.

[Derek L]

I don't think it will be a deluge or that the demise of the LGR will have much if anything to do with it.

I do think however there will be an increase in gun deaths due to mental illness, because there is going to be more mental illness in the future and probably more guns too.

That’s an opinion that you’re certainly entitled to, but like all other forms of illness, with modern advancements in medicine and/or treatments, isn’t it reasonable to also assume that your concern with a potential increase in instances of said illnesses as the baby boomers age could also be countered with modern and future advancements?


As a personal observation, I spent this morning at a gun show (a monthly occurrence) in Burnaby that’s put on by a club I belong to……..Now this said club is predominantly made up of seniors, with a likely average age of 70-75 (It would probably be higher if not for my small group of “youngsters” in our late 40s).

Now many of these seniors are veterans of WW II (getting fewer) and Korea, both obviously life changing events, that a reasonable person could assume could play on ones mental health…………The reason I bring this up is that my personal observations with these older folks (and admittedly I’m not a trained professional) I’d question if any suffer from any form of mental illness (aside from how they price their rifles!!)

What makes you feel our generation (Baby Boomers)will see such a drastic increase in mental illness? When contrasted with the previous generation, there has been no major life changing events on par with WW II or Korea that our generation was forced to endure…….So why do you think there will be a sudden increase?

[eyeball]

Funny how you bring up the one negative quote from “unnamed sources”, but fail to mention all the remaining ones that paint the suspect in a positive or neutral light, well giving their names……

Folks around Killam also seem pretty gun-neutral if not friendly.

Clarke would often shoot on Sundays, and the gunshots could be heard echoing across the rolling fields

Then there's this story.

The manhunt ended peacefully before the sun came up, but RCMP are still searching for a truck last seen leaving the scene of this week’s police shooting — a black Silverado they think may be filled with weapons.

Sawyer Clarke Robison, 27, was arrested at 5 a.m. Friday on a country road within 15 kilometres of the farm where two RCMP officers were shot Tuesday.

Robison was unarmed.

“We cannot locate the truck. We cannot locate the weapons,” said RCMP spokesman Sgt. Patrick Webb. “We’re not saying it’s rigged in any way. That’s the fear. We want to err on the side of caution.”

So the search continues for a three-door 2000 Chevrolet Silverado with licence plate UZE 545.

Police are asking anyone who lives within a 100 kilometre radius of Killam to check abandoned buildings and wooded areas on their property. If someone finds the truck, RCMP say it could be dangerous to open the doors.


Read more: http://www.edmontonj...l#ixzz1mDkhyzzl

The trickle of details seems to mirror the trickle of breaks the police are getting in terms of getting to the bottom of whatever it is they've gotten themselves into. I can't shake the sense the police tried to take on someone with really strong feelings towards uncontrolled and unrestrained gun ownership. You were just asking how many deaths might be associated with the demise of the LGR, perhaps Brad Clarke's feelings towards the state taking his guns away were emboldened by just that very thing and now he's dead.

What appears to be a strained relationship between police and Albertan's in general is at odds with the respect for law and order you'd normally associate with such a conservative place. Gun ownership might be another growing sore point.