65 replies to this topic

[Boges]

Some people actually get an education at the library, while the pool, as has already been mentioned to you, encourages children to live a healthier lifestyle and provides them with fundamental safety skills.

But they aren't essential public services like education, public safety and garbage removal.

As a student I went to Libraries to get better resources, but then again I didn't have internet. School's have libraries don't they?

Kids can get physical activities by playing street hockey or any number of outdoor activities that are free.

Edited by Boges, 18 January 2012 - 11:12 AM.

[Boges]

If you were supposed to spend every cent of your income without going over, then no... you don't have a spending problem. In fact, it's quite easy to see how you would use your tax return to pay your phone bill.

It's a case of fixed expenses and discretionary expenses.

There are things that the City needs to spend money on and they have to budget for it. Just like I budget for my cable bill, car payment, insurance, mortgage etc.

At the end of the year I hope I have some money left over. Shouldn't I put that towards paying down debt or towards retirement and not the expenses of next year?

Edited by Boges, 18 January 2012 - 11:16 AM.

[Scotty]

There is what you need, and what you want. Then there's what you can afford. Toronto will either learn to prune down it's 'wants' or go bankrupt, and I really don't care which.

[Black Dog]

But they aren't essential public services like education, public safety and garbage removal.

You could probably have a city that doesn't run anything but "essential public services."

It would probably be a pretty shitty place to live, though.

[Boges]

You could probably have a city that doesn't run anything but "essential public services."

Who's proposing such a thing?

[jacee]

But they aren't essential public services like education, public safety and garbage removal.

As a student I went to Libraries to get better resources, but then again I didn't have internet. School's have libraries don't they?

Kids can get physical activities by playing street hockey or any number of outdoor activities that are free.

He shouldn't be picking on children looking for cuts.
These are programs for inner city kids and famulies with few resources, designed to keep kids oof the streets an out of the crime that surrounds them, programs arising from past experience and known to be effective.

Any short term financial 'gain' is at long term expense ... ie, not smart.

What kids do when they're not in school is critical to our whole society too.

[cybercoma]

Of course he's picking on those with the least power: children and the poor. The guy is a jerk.

[jacee]

Well I do consider both going to the Library and a Pool leisure activities actually.

Beats kids stealing and selling weed in their leisure time though.

Every healthy community MUST have leisure time activities for every kid.

Ask the police.

[huh]

He shouldn't be picking on children looking for cuts.
These are programs for inner city kids and famulies with few resources, designed to keep kids oof the streets an out of the crime that surrounds them, programs arising from past experience and known to be effective.

Any short term financial 'gain' is at long term expense ... ie, not smart.

What kids do when they're not in school is critical to our whole society too.

Surely every activity and entitlement is essential and we must spend, spend, spend, until bankruptcy at which time there will be no spending for anyone, including on those things that are nesecary, but hey, you can always tax those of us with jobs even more, surely the time and effort we put into creating our livelihoods needs to be punished.

[jacee]

Surely every activity and entitlement is essential and we must spend, spend, spend, until bankruptcy at which time there will be no spending for anyone, including on those things that are nesecary, but hey, you can always tax those of us with jobs even more, surely the time and effort we put into creating our livelihoods needs to be punished.

Programs for kids are not frills. They are essential to minimize future costs and maximize human potential. It's clear to me that there are people who just do not comprehend that human services are more important than snowplows and garbage trucks and other mechanical toys.
And it's clear that those who don't understand are those who know nothing about human services and shouldn't be making decisions about children's programs because they do not respect children.

[CPCFTW]

Close the pools and libraries and buy up some used xboxes and ps2's for the poor underprivileged children. Nothing keeps a kid out of the street better than a game console. It would be a hell of a lot cheaper than libraries and pools which is about the last place I would expect to find a troubled youth.

Edited by CPCFTW, 18 January 2012 - 11:34 PM.

[mentalfloss]

Close the pools and libraries and buy up some used xboxes and ps2's for the poor underprivileged children. Nothing keeps a kid out of the street better than a game console.

I can get behind that.

[Boges]

Well since the OP was just a re-post of a Star column I thought I'd counter with this, equally as partisan, article.

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/01/18/budget-battle-not-a-loss-for-ford

Even the facts didn’t sway them — facts like the 10 school pools they saved are not only under utilized but cost $12/swim compared to $2/swim at city pools.

Or the fact that the ice rinks they fought to keep open sit empty 97% of the time and they’ve spent $260,000 on keeping the lights on and CUPE staff employed.

Or that the three day care centres they rescued – for a whopping $1.6-million – have a grand total of 44 kids in them. That’s $36,000 this year per kid. Very fiscally responsible. Or that the lion’s share of the $2.8-million in community service grants they so proudly reinstated go to groups in former deputy mayor Joe Pantalone’s (now Mike Layton) and former TTC chairman Adam Giambrone’s (now Ana Bailao) wards.

These were hardly service cuts.

Either they chose not to do their homework or they chose not to listen.

They have to look in the mirror and face their constituents.

But stunning loss? Pul-lease.

Let’s be real.

If these numbers are to be believed, the way this money is to be spent isn't exactly good stewardship of taxpayer money.

And to imply that if there wasn't an arena or a pool available for free for poor youths, they'd be criminals, is rather offensive. Don't their taxpayer-funded schools have extra-curricular activities? Aren't there already public parks for kids to play in. Are community centres all across the city bursting at the seams from over-use?

Also is there any evidence that these specific pools and arenas were keeping kids out of gangs?

Edited by Boges, 19 January 2012 - 07:15 AM.

[Black Dog]

If these numbers are to be believed, the way this money is to be spent isn't exactly good stewardship of taxpayer money.

I'll be frank: I don't believe a word Sue-Anne Levy writes.

I'd like to know where this rationale was beforehand.

[Boges]

I'll be frank: I don't believe a word Sue-Anne Levy writes.

I'd like to know where this rationale was beforehand.

I'm sure the same could be said, by many, about someone like Royson James.