224 replies to this topic

[bud]

I'm not asking you to support anything. I'm not asking any leftist to support anything (war or otherwise). I was saying that some of the left would disagree with you and you don't have a monopoly on left-wing views. If you want to brush me off as irrational for pointing out that others on the left may see things slightly different than you...well, than you don't see your own irrationality or closed-mindedness.

do your leftist friends support:

a) the afghanistan war
israel's wars on the palestinians and on lebanon
c) u.s. and canada's support for israel considering their actions

Edited by bud, 20 March 2012 - 01:12 PM.

[The_Squid]

Has anyone heard a word from the Taliban and all those Muslim people self-appointed champions?

Why do you care what the Taliban thinks about anything?

You are surprised that the Taliban is hypocritical?

Edited by The_Squid, 20 March 2012 - 01:14 PM.

[j44]

do your leftist friends support:

a) the afghanistan war
israel's wars on the palestinians and on lebanon
c) u.s. and canada's support for israel considering their actions

Do you want me to email them and ask them?

[bud]

Do you want me to email them and ask them?

i want you to stop being ridiculous.

[j44]

i want you to stop being ridiculous.

lol

[WWWTT]

i want you to stop being ridiculous.

Good luck with that one!

WWWTT

[DogOnPorch]

No actually the way I remember it the US was becoming frustrated the Viet Cong continueslly fled into Laos and Cambodia.So Nixon ended up bombing what they believed was the Ho Che Min trail through those countries.Killing hundreds of thousands of civilians.

By the end of 1967, the VC were no more for all practical purposes; decimated by Tet and several very effective S&D operations, leaving only the NVA...troops of another nation...to do the 'freedom fighting' in the South. The Ho Chi Minh Trail was a fact since the 1950s when the North first started sending THEIR military into Laos and Cambodia on the way south.

Maybe the numbers are off but they are still up there.

Bombing the Trail didn't cost 100s of thousands of civilian dead in two already troubled countries with actual invasions from North Viet-Nam going on. The Trail(s) was running through dense jungle along the border for a reason. Certainly part of the mayhem but certainly not the sole vector of misery in Indochina. But, you're free to provide figures proving me wrong.

May I point out aswell that the US invaded Vietnam.

WWWTT

Uhhh...no they didn't. The US sent in the Marines to protect the SVN/US airbases that were being attacked by the North with SVN approval. When the North continued to operate in these areas, the Marines began S&D operations to clear them out. This led to troop escalation on BOTH sides as the US ramped up the feet on the ground and the North pushed entire divisions south along the Trail.

[Jack Weber]

Uhhh...no they didn't. The US sent in the Marines to protect the SVN/US airbases that were being attacked by the North with SVN approval. When the North continued to operate in these areas, the Marines began S&D operations to clear them out. This led to troop escalation on BOTH sides as the US ramped up the feet on the ground and the North pushed entire divisions south along the Trail.

Uh....Well...There was that little Gulf of Tonkin "incident" (see: the Reichstag Fire,as a point of reference) that acted as a trigger...

[DogOnPorch]

Uh....Well...There was that little Gulf of Tonkin "incident" (see: the Reichstag Fire,as a point of reference) that acted as a trigger...

That's not why troops were sent to South Viet-Nam. The Gulf of Tonkin opened the door for air operations in the North...which started before any regular US troops were on the ground. The US had been in the area since 1959 or so as advisors, trainers, aircraft pilots (Trojans mainly) and helicopter pilots (CH-21s and CH-34s).

Edited by DogOnPorch, 20 March 2012 - 02:50 PM.

[DogOnPorch]

[Jack Weber]

That's not why troops were sent to South Viet-Nam. The Gulf of Tonkin opened the door for air operations in the North...which started before any regular US troops were on the ground. The US had been in the area since 1959 or so as advisors, trainers, aircraft pilots (Trojans mainly) and helicopter pilots (CH-21s and CH-34s).

Right...It was a trigger to escalate the war...And,like the Reichstag Fire,a well known "false flag" event....

[DogOnPorch]

Right...It was a trigger to escalate the war...And,like the Reichstag Fire,a well known "false flag" event....

Only the second part of the Gulf of Tonkin is suspected of being a so-called false flag operation. Either way, the North was being pretty cocky in the South already. About a decade already... Some posters forget this little tid bit. Ever so keen on painting the USA as EVIL (Darth Vader breathing), they toss their hat into the ring with a country that invaded 3 other neutral countries to achieve its ends with good ol' Russia helping from the shadows. All the while, patting themselves on the back for a job well done at getting the US out of Indochina at the cost of untold millions in the Killing Fields and during the Boat People era.

It makes me chuckle.

Edited by DogOnPorch, 20 March 2012 - 03:10 PM.

[Jack Weber]

Only the second part of the Gulf of Tonkin is suspected of being a so-called false flag operation. Either way, the North was being pretty cocky in the South already. About a decade already... Some posters forget this little tid bit. Ever so keen on painting the USA as EVIL (Darth Vader breathing), they toss their hat into the ring with a country that invaded 3 other neutral countries to achieve its ends with good ol' Russia helping from the shadows. All the while, patting themselves on the back for a job well done at getting the US out of Indochina at the cost of untold millions in the Killing Fields and during the Boat People era.

It makes me chuckle.

I'll bet those boat people were'nt chuckling...

And both were/are "evil",just different versions of it.One was a follower of a horrible dehumanizing idealogy.The other used the sales pitch of being beacon of freedom while propping up bloodthirsty Fascist dictators to grow the influence of the empire...

[WWWTT]

Uhhh...no they didn't. The US sent in the Marines to protect the SVN/US airbases that were being attacked by the North with SVN approval. When the North continued to operate in these areas, the Marines began S&D operations to clear them out. This led to troop escalation on BOTH sides as the US ramped up the feet on the ground and the North pushed entire divisions south along the Trail.

Oh OK then I guess the Soviets did not invade Afganistan either,they were invited over to help the then ruling party.

And as far as stats go,I rather take the word from the people who are from there as opposed to wikileaks(america)

WWWTT

[DogOnPorch]

I'll bet those boat people were'nt chuckling...

And both were/are "evil",just different versions of it.One was a follower of a horrible dehumanizing idealogy.The other used the sales pitch of being beacon of freedom while propping up bloodthirsty Fascist dictators to grow the influence of the empire...

Diem was fighting his own war against various armed religious armies while ramming Roman Catholic rules down the Buddhists' throats. His enemies were equally bloodthirsty at times. But, he truely prefered the role of playboy along with his Westernized sister-in-law. Shopping in Paris saved her skin. But Diem was better than the Commies, it turned out.

Edited by DogOnPorch, 20 March 2012 - 03:25 PM.