3900 replies to this topic

[Derek L]

citation request

googly isn't that forthcoming at the moment... for now, I'll throw this one up - I trust your citation (and supporting detail) will shoot it down:


pending your update/correction, for now, I'll go with the F-35 @ $32,500 per hour // F/A-18 @ $18,900 per hour. Wow! Quite the difference, hey? But again, the point being you don't seem to have an actual comment on the Pentagon figure of $32,500 an hour for the F-35! Apparently, to you... whatever it costs... it costs, right?

But hey, we're not purchasing the "B" and "C" versions......

[Derek L]

So when do we take delivery of the aircraft? Until we do, all the speculation of how this aircraft operates in exercises or real operations is still waiting to take off (very punny).

Until then, the cost of these things has essentially already doubled. The government admits they hid the numbers, they admit mistakes, and they admit it's a lot of freakin money.

Even if we have all 65 of these things.... it's not enough to cover the territory that is Canada. Too high of a cost for the number of aircraft we are getting.

I say we wait for the Chinese to complete the J-20 !!! We could buy 4x as many for half the price.

The USA is the only entity using 5th generation fighters, so by default, they already have the upper hand. And the F-22 is showing to have some small but yet critical issues (no oxygen feed to the pilots), and many are refusing to fly them, one incident took an F-22 pilots life because of the oxygen feed issue.

But if it's a case of numbers, 65 F-35s won't stand a chance against the multitude of Chinese made J-20s. Even if they are better.

Case in point was the tank situation in WWII. The German Panzers were really tough, and it was simply the sheer numbers of Shermans that were built and deployed that won the battles against the Germans.

As mentioned by smallc, the numbers of aircraft within the fighter squadrons (24x2) won’t change from Hornet to F-35, and the reduction from ~80 to 65 is a reflection of us no longer requiring a conversion squadron (-20-24 aircraft)

[eyeball]

Yes really! That's why we need to wait to buy Chinese j20s instead of f35s! 80 j20s will fare much better against thousands of enemy j20s than 65 f35s will! I know it's hard to keep up with ghosthack's (or any other lefty's) deeply flawed logic!

Excuse me but, where could China ever possibly get the resources it would need to build the 1000's of J20s they intend to invade us with, not to mention all the other resources it would need for it's invasion force?

[DogOnPorch]

Excuse me but, where could China ever possibly get the resources it would need to build the 1000's of J20s they intend to invade us with, not to mention all the other resources it would need for it's invasion force?

Canada by the looks.

[DogOnPorch]

are you Maverick... or Goose?

It's interesting that all air combat takes place within camera range of the ground, eh?

[bush_cheney2004]

It's interesting that all air combat takes place within camera range of the ground, eh?

Jingo time!

[DogOnPorch]

Jingo all the way. (good footage there, by the way.)



That's the ticket.

[bush_cheney2004]

[DogOnPorch]

That event always reminds me of the XB-70 accident.

[bush_cheney2004]

That event always reminds me of the XB-70 accident.

Expensive day that was....that's why I tell my son to give XB-70's a wide berth on the road.

[bush_cheney2004]

[wyly]

Excuse me but, where could China ever possibly get the resources it would need to build the 1000's of J20s they intend to invade us with, not to mention all the other resources it would need for it's invasion force?

J20's with a combat range of 2000k hey ya we need to really worry about that...round trip china/canada being about 12,000K I don't think I'll lose sleep over J20's ...

there's an unexplainable paranoia that grips the right, they tremble in their beds at the thought of the chinese stealing our oil which we sell to them now at a cost infinitely less than that of a full scale invasion...even with the DND dismissing any external threats to canada the paranoid still cling to their delusions...the entire thought of invading Canada is ludicrous, an invasion of that scale would be seen years in advance, Canada is the most capable non-nuclear armed country on the planet...estimates for producing nukes have been put between 6-12 months, a nuclear armed canada makes any threat invasion moot...

[DogOnPorch]

Expensive day that was....that's why I tell my son to give XB-70's a wide berth on the road.

Indeed it was. But, its very (brief) existence led to the very aircraft flying today. XB-70 = MiG-25 = F-15 = MiG-29 = etc. All for the want of a Mach 3 bomber...

Good plan re: wide berth...those rudders are killers.

[DogOnPorch]

J20's with a combat range of 2000k hey ya we need to really worry about that...round trip china/canada being about 12,000K I don't think I'll lose sleep over J20's ...

J15s though are another matter, eh?

[CPCFTW]

J20's with a combat range of 2000k hey ya we need to really worry about that...round trip china/canada being about 12,000K I don't think I'll lose sleep over J20's ...

there's an unexplainable paranoia that grips the right, they tremble in their beds at the thought of the chinese stealing our oil which we sell to them now at a cost infinitely less than that of a full scale invasion...even with the DND dismissing any external threats to canada the paranoid still cling to their delusions...the entire thought of invading Canada is ludicrous, an invasion of that scale would be seen years in advance, Canada is the most capable non-nuclear armed country on the planet...estimates for producing nukes have been put between 6-12 months, a nuclear armed canada makes any threat invasion moot...

Why do you guys keep bringing up China as if I was suggesting an invasion is imminent? I was clearly playing along with Gosthack's hypotheticals. I am a capitalist... I support free trade with China. Get that through your heads!

Furthermore, the right in Canada is not paranoid about China. In fact, the right is trying desperately to construct a pipeline to ship oil to China. Judging by the posts in this thread, that "paranoia" is an illusion borne from the left's lack of reading comprehension.

Now lefties, get your thinking caps on and let us all review my post:

You really think we'd only have 65 f35s in the case of a war with China? If you're going to use ridiculous hypotheticals to make your argument then I can use another ridiculous hypothetical: in the case of a war with China we'd buy hundreds more f35s.

Furthermore, if 65 f35s won't stand a chance against China, do you think 80-100 j20s will (assuming the j20 is up to 50% cheaper)?

Note how I said "if you're going to use ridiculous hypotheticals". That ridiculous hypothetical is the following:

But if it's a case of numbers, 65 F-35s won't stand a chance against the multitude of Chinese made J-20s. Even if they are better.

Presumably GostHacked was referring to China when he was saying the F35s "won't stand a change against the multitude of Chinese made J-20s", unless there is another superpower threat I'm not aware of that could significantly overpower our F35 fleet with J-20s.

Now lefties, try to put 2 and 2 together here for once in your lives. Gosthacked brings up the hypothetical situation where our f35s are overpowered by multitudes of J20s, then I say that this is a ridiculous hypothetical. Conclusion??? I must fear an imminent Chinese invasion!!!

I hope that clarifies things for you lefties. Now keep the feigned outrage and comedic overreactions coming!

Edited by CPCFTW, 09 May 2012 - 08:40 PM.