30 replies to this topic

[cybercoma]

So, Topaz posed an interesting question in another thread to Conservative supporters. If the Progressive Conservative Party came back and in the next election you had to choose between the two, which party would you choose?

I think it's worth discussing. Mr. Chretien made an excellent point on P&P (believe me, it pains me to give that man credit for anything), the present Conservative Party is not the Reform Party, nor it it the Progressive Conservative Party. Ideologically it's different than both. So, if there was a split in the party and more progressive conservatives formed a new Progressive Conservative Party, with similar platforms and ideology to the old PCs, which party would you vote for? Of course, this assumes you would vote conservative at all.

Edited by cybercoma, 24 April 2012 - 10:22 AM.

[Boges]

So, Topaz posed an interesting question in another thread to Conservative supporters. If the Progressive Conservative Party came back and in the next election you had to choose between the two, which party would you choose?

I think it's worth discussing. Mr. Chretien made an excellent point on P&P (believe me, it pains me to give that man credit for anything), the present Conservative Party is not the Reform Party, nor it it the Progressive Conservative Party. Ideologically it's different than both. So, if there was a split in the party and more progressive conservatives formed a new Progressive Conservative Party, with similar platforms and ideology to the old PCs, which party would you vote for? Of course, this assumes you would vote conservative at all.

That's totally hypothetical and likely will never happen unless the CPC move too far to the left again making a grassroots movement rise up and try to replace them.

The Harris Conservatives were technically PC but, The Ontario PCs were closer to to the Alliance or Reform than they were the Federal PCs, at the time.

[cybercoma]

Of course it's hypothetical. The question is about whether people would vote for the current Conservatives or a conservative party that's closer to the centre. It's clear this Conservative Party is further right than the PCs, given their support for the Wildrose in Alberta.

[Boges]

Of course it's hypothetical. The question is about whether people would vote for the current Conservatives or a conservative party that's closer to the centre. It's clear this Conservative Party is further right than the PCs, given their support for the Wildrose in Alberta.

I know you're a Dipper and you probably think you can't get much further right than the current CPC.

But the CPC has done an excellent job trying to be a big-tent party that steals from the centre. See the Liberals dropping to 31 seats, many of which were taken by the CPC in Ontario.

I wasn't politically aware when the Mulroney PCs where in power, but from what I hear, they really weren't that Conservative at all.

Edited by Boges, 24 April 2012 - 10:30 AM.

[madmax]

I wasn't politically aware when the Mulroney PCs where in power, but from what I hear, they really weren't that Conservative at all.

There are similarities.
A string of scandals in a short period of time.
A record Deficit
Incompetent Ministers
Entitlement
Pork Politics

Edited by madmax, 24 April 2012 - 12:06 PM.

[Boges]

There are similarities.
A string of scandals in a short period of time. String? Who's even talking about Robocall anymore?
A record Deficit: Yeah the CPCs deficit wasn't caused by the stimulus spending demanded by the opposition in a minority situation or anything.
Incompetent Ministers: I'll give you Bed Oda
Entitlement and Pork Politics: Just like every part elected to any position of power anywhere. . . ever.

Edited by Boges, 24 April 2012 - 12:22 PM.

[Manny]

There are similarities.
A string of scandals in a short period of time.
A record Deficit
Incompetent Ministers
Entitlement
Pork Politics

Just the mention of the name Mulroney makes some of my body parts contract and I want to punch the person standing immediately to the left of me. It's a reflex

[Keepitsimple]

I've always shook my head over the term "progressive". It's never really defined. How can a party like the NDP who don't like free trade, extol big government re-distribution schemes, want to tax businesses to death along with productive individuals, and have no idea how to create wealth.....how can such a party be viewed as "Progressive"? Can someone explain the wooly-headed concept of "progressive"?

I have this silly notion that governments are supposed to put a framework of rules in place that allow people to work hard and get ahead - while at the same time looking after the most vulnerable in our midst. There will always be people who work harder than others, those who are smarter than others - and there will others who don't work hard or are simply not too bright....and yes, there are bums and laggards. The concept of legislating some sort of "equality" for everyone is reckless....

[Jack Weber]

There are similarities.
A string of scandals in a short period of time.
A record Deficit
Incompetent Ministers
Entitlement
Pork Politics

You forgot the RCMP camped out at 24 Sussex Drive near the end of the Mulroney era...

Got Robocalls???

Edited by Jack Weber, 24 April 2012 - 01:03 PM.

[Machjo]

So, Topaz posed an interesting question in another thread to Conservative supporters. If the Progressive Conservative Party came back and in the next election you had to choose between the two, which party would you choose?

I think it's worth discussing. Mr. Chretien made an excellent point on P&P (believe me, it pains me to give that man credit for anything), the present Conservative Party is not the Reform Party, nor it it the Progressive Conservative Party. Ideologically it's different than both. So, if there was a split in the party and more progressive conservatives formed a new Progressive Conservative Party, with similar platforms and ideology to the old PCs, which party would you vote for? Of course, this assumes you would vote conservative at all.

Isn't the Green Party essentially a moderately greener version of the old Progressive conservative Party anyway, a sort of "blue gren" party?

If you look at its platform, it's essentially economically liberal and socially liberal. Or maybe we could compare it to a kind of blue liberal party of sorts.

[eyeball]

I have this silly notion that governments are supposed to put a framework of rules in place that allow people to work hard and get ahead

Well, the rules governing my region are concentrating access to it's natural resources into the hands of people that don't live here resulting in less opportunity for people who do to work and get ahead.

I don't know who's notion it was to allow this state of affairs to develop but I doubt very much if it was the NDP.

[Argus]

We already have a liberal party, and people aren't voting for it.
What's the difference between them and a "progressive conservative" party? They both hate conservative ideals and ideas. They're both fiscal incompetents. Why would we want a second liberal party? That was the question which doomed the existing PC party. No one saw a need for their continued existence given they were 99% identical to the Liberals in their ideological, fiscal and social views.

[Wild Bill]

I guess not enough people are old enough to remember those days. Many presently on the left keep hoping that the CPC will fully morph back into the old PC party, since they are more comfortable with all parties being on various degrees of the left and further from what they fear is a true conservative position.

They might be right but from the POV of someone who lived through those times it just doesn't seem likely. Reform's seat count and percentage of the popular vote was FAR more than that of the PCs! At the time the parties merged, the PCs were left with just a handful of seats in the Maritimes. It seemed every time an election was held they lost a bit more. They would likely have been totally dead at the time of the merger except for the very poor and outright goofy leadership of Stockwell Day.

Somehow I can't see the majority of those old Reform votes once again embracing the PC party. It just makes no sense at all.

[fellowtraveller]

OP just cannot acknowledge how Harper won his majority, too scary.
The question you are asking but afraid to say is: will the centrist PC party ruling Canuckistan today tear itself to bits with internal dissent?
Dude. move on.

[Topaz]

The reason I asked to question was in one of the committee hearing when Schreiber was on the hot seat, when asked a question by one of the Conservatives on the panel, he said he had given money to the Liberals and the Conservatives, to which the Tory member said, "That's not us, that was the Progressive Conservatives". So I am still wondering what is the difference. Now, I think the difference is Harper uses the name "Conservative" to get the votes in the East but rules like a reformer.