84 replies to this topic

[Derek L]

Whatever his reasons may be, it's a good thing. One might question the timing but peoples opinions do "evolve" over time. I know mine have on different issues, including this one.

Agreed.

[American Woman]

I have to say, I sure didn't expect the opening post of this thread by AW to be negative towards a Canadian poster being critical of US government.

"Critical of U.S. government" when it pertains to something positive. That's what has me shaking my head. Furthermore, this is Obama's view, not "the U.S. government's" - any more than North Carolina = America per Black Dog's moronic status update. I put both of your reactions in the same category. It boggles the mind that some of you even take a positive thing and make it negative - which really speaks volumes. I suppose that's why gays can marry in Canada, though - because some politician was playing the political card.

Canadian Criticism Derangement Syndrome!

Perhaps I shouldn't have been surprised after all. Perhaps you're not nearly as intelligent as I had thought.

[American Woman]

Whatever his reasons may be, it's a good thing. One might question the timing but peoples opinions do "evolve" over time. I know mine have on different issues, including this one.

A a CNN/ORC poll, taken in late March, indicated policies towards gays and lesbians were tied for last in the most-important issues facing the country, so I'm not sure if the timing is even going to be beneficial - perhaps it could be the opposite.

At any rate, Obama himself has said that he has evolved on the issue:

Obama once opposed such marriages. He later indicated his views were "evolving."

"I had hesitated on gay marriage, in part, because I thought civil unions would be sufficient," the president said. "I was sensitive to the fact that -- for a lot of people -- that the word marriage is something that provokes very powerful traditions and religious beliefs."

But, Obama said, his thinking shifted as he witnessed committed same-sex marriages and thought about U.S. service personnel who were "not able to commit themselves in a marriage."

Obama said his daughters, Malia and Sasha, have friends whose parents are same-sex couples. "It wouldn't dawn on them that somehow their friends' parents would be treated differently. It doesn't make sense to them and frankly, that's the kind of thing that prompts a change in perspective." link

I find this disappointing, though: The president said he supports the concept of states deciding the issue on their own, ABC News reported. It sort of makes his support, as POTUS, rather meaningless as far as national acceptance goes. As I recall, that was always Dick Cheney's stance.

[Wilber]

I find this disappointing, though: The president said he supports the concept of states deciding the issue on their own, ABC News reported. It sort of makes his support, as POTUS, rather meaningless as far as national acceptance goes. As I recall, that was always Dick Cheney's stance.

Agreed. Now he has taken a postion, he should pursue it. He does not represent the states, he was elected by the whole country.

[Moonlight Graham]

"Critical of U.S. government" when it pertains to something positive. That's what has me shaking my head. Furthermore, this is Obama's view, not "the U.S. government's" - any more than North Carolina = America per Black Dog's moronic status update. I put both of your reactions in the same category. It boggles the mind that some of you even take a positive thing and make it negative - which really speaks volumes. I suppose that's why gays can marry in Canada, though - because some politician was playing the political card.

You must have missed the part where I stated:

Thanks for adding that. Yes, it is a good thing, first and foremost. I should have added that to my OP.

It may be a political move, but the POTUS supporting gay marriage is historic. I do applaud Obama for doing it, but it should have been done sooner IMO. Better late than never!

Moonlight can admit when he has not been quite fair on an issue, as I was not in the OP. This is a positive thing that he came out and said what he did, as I've stated. At the same time, maybe if he had the stones to stand up and say this a few years ago he would have had more impact furthering gay rights.

Why am I even wasting my time responding to this?

[kimmy]

Forum member Punked made a quip in his status update that Obama's position didn't "evolve", it "etch-a-sketched", referring to the comment from Romney's staffer.

When asked whether the conservative rhetoric Romney was spouting to win the Republican nomination would hurt his electability in the general election, the staffer replied that that once the nomination was locked up, it would be like an etch-a-sketch and they would give it a few shakes and all that stuff would be erased.

Romney wants to talk about the economy. He doesn't want the election to be about social issues.

Each time a state puts social issues back in the news-- whether it be North Carolina's new amendment, or some state pushing mandatory invasive ultrasound, or whatever Tennessee is up to next, it puts social issues back in the news, puts "the culture wars" back in focus, takes the economy out of the spotlight, and makes it just a little harder for Mitt Romney to "shake the etch-a-sketch".

Speaking up on this doesn't win Obama votes-- people who care that much were already going to vote Democrat-- but it does cost Romney votes. Moderates who may be thinking "well, Mitt doesn't seem like such a bad guy, and I'm concerned about the economy..." will have second thoughts about voting Republican when Mitt has to keep standing up for conservative views on social issues.


-k

[waldo]

Obama supports gay marriage... and the Mitt was a bullying gay basher... oh my!

Edited by waldo, 10 May 2012 - 09:44 PM.

[kimmy]

Obama supports gay marriage... and the Mitt was a bullying gay basher... oh my!

What Obama was doing as an 18 year old matters a lot! What Romney was doing as an 18 year old is ... uh... boys will be boys!

Romney has two different stories. The first is that he can't recall any such incident, and he's sorry if some of his "pranks" offended anybody. The other version is that they didn't attack the kid because they thought he was gay. It will be interesting to see which he decides to stick with.

-k

[Black Dog]

"Critical of U.S. government" when it pertains to something positive. That's what has me shaking my head. Furthermore, this is Obama's view, not "the U.S. government's" - any more than North Carolina = America per Black Dog's moronic status update. I put both of your reactions in the same category. It boggles the mind that some of you even take a positive thing and make it negative - which really speaks volumes. I suppose that's why gays can marry in Canada, though - because some politician was playing the political card.

As positive as the POTUS' stance on SSM is, there's also a lot of morans like the good ol' boys'n'girls down in North Carlinuh, which, last I checked, was a state in America.

So good on Obama for "evolving" now let's just hope more of your country crawls from the primordial oooze of superstition and ignorance sooner rather than later.

[Michael Hardner]

What Obama was doing as an 18 year old matters a lot!

Maybe we can come to an agreement on this. I would say that youthful indiscretions don't matter, generally, prior to 18 and to a lesser degree prior to college graduation.

[GostHacked]

it was an astute move politically, he isn't going to lose the black or Hispanic vote because of it, he has no hope of getting the hard right evangelicals or the racist vote but gays and their direct families probably make up 10% of the population so locking up that demographic can give him enough of an edge to win reelection...and Romney can't go there without losing support from the right...

Agreed, it's perfect timing. More political points, Obama touts the CIA stopping another panty bomber (which turns out is a Brit National with CIA credentials) ... comes out for gay marriage .. yes indeed the election season in the USA is around the corner!

[Shakeyhands]

Maybe we can come to an agreement on this. I would say that youthful indiscretions don't matter, generally, prior to 18 and to a lesser degree prior to college graduation.

Hmmm... Like this ones mistakes. Too bad she feels the need for people to hear stupid commentary.

Seriously?

[American Woman]

Agreed. Now he has taken a postion, he should pursue it. He does not represent the states, he was elected by the whole country.

Exactly. I don't understand this "state issue" mindset - it's not a state issue. A spouse is entitled to benefits, some of them federal (social security, for example), therefore it's a federal issue - and he should be pursuing it as such in light of his statement.

[American Woman]

As positive as the POTUS' stance on SSM is, there's also a lot of morans like the good ol' boys'n'girls down in North Carlinuh, which, last I checked, was a state in America.

Yeah, it's IN America - but it's not America. Last time I checked, it was legal in several states for gays to marry, so using your mindset ... good for America, eh? They stand for America. Furthermore, your comment about it being legal for cousins to marry in N.C. is just plain ignorant - considering it's legal for cousins to marry in Canada. What point do you think you were making?

So good on Obama for "evolving" now let's just hope more of your country crawls from the primordial oooze of superstition and ignorance sooner rather than later.

I wonder who's going to crawl out from their primordial oooze of superstition and ignorance sooner - the U.S. or Canada? I'm betting that it will be legal for gays to marry throughout the U.S. before your head of state can be a Catholic or married to a Catholic.

Edited by American Woman, 11 May 2012 - 10:23 AM.

[bush_cheney2004]

...Furthermore, your comment about it being legal for cousins to marry in N.C. is just plain ignorant - considering it's legal for cousins to marry in Canada. What point do you think you were making?

Oh, I suspect it's just the usual kind of lazy "Bubba Land slur". The US South is a favorite target for the oh so smug types. Turns out that Duke University (Durham, North Carolina, USA) out ranks all but one university in the entire nation of Canada.


http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2011-2012/top-400.html