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Alberta Election

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Stelmach and the PEECEE are the new leftwing in Alberta. Stelmach's pre-election spending promises amount to 120 Billion in Tax Dollars. Even Don Getty and PET look like miserly bastard's, compared to the old Communist Stelmach. He has made a few Billion in promises since calling the election. His Ego is huge. His brain is small, and he is desparate.

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Well I am a Canadian first and foremost and a 22 year Alberta resident second. Do the crackpot right-wingers in here remember that all this land used to be owned by the Hudson's Bay Company and was purchased by the CANADIAN government? So Alberta got lucky enough to have geographical boundaries drawn up that contained a bunch of dead dinosaurs, big deal. To credit the Conservative government with the economic success of Alberta is a little like saying the Oilers of the eighties were successful because of Glen Sather. Quebec had Maurice D. Newfoundland had Joey Smallwood , Alberta has the Conservative party, all things come to an end, and thank god for that. The boom in this province and the mentality of several expressed in here is ludicrous! Ask those who grew up in Fort McMurray and can't afford to live in the city they grew up in because a twenty year old house is worth $600,000, ask seniors how they feel about sky-rocketing rents on a fixed income, ask students how they feel when they have to visit the ever expanding food bank on UofA campus just to eat because tuition fees in Alberta have went up over 400% since 1991. Conservative budgeting is like a person who makes sure their utilities bill gets paid every month while their roof caves in because the shingles haven't been changed in twenty years. Even Peter Lougheed suggests that the current Tory plan of rubber stamping every oil project coming down the line is ridiculous. Driving 45 minutes north of Fort McMurray can make us all feel a little like Neil Armstrong when he landed on the moon. This province is the modern day panhandle and everyone is here panning for their gold and just like the Gold Rush when oil prices drop through the floor or we just plane run out Albertans will be left holding the bag for an environmental disaster and no money to pay for it. The government has ignored the task forces on housing and seniors, and skewed the results of the task force on royalties by not providing all the information they had, all I can say is thank god for Edmonton and the fact that we vote for the opposition parties, my hope is that we can at least rid this city of Conservatives in this election, and when are urban Albertans going to wake up and realize that 60% of the provinces population lives in the two major cities and yet we let hinterland rural Alberta swing more power and seats then the cities? Enough is enough for gods sake provincial electoral boundaries should reflect where the people are not the Conservatives! Federally speaking all I can say is thank god for Ontario and Quebec who have not bought in to this Conservative propaganda. To me the only difference between a Liberal and a Conservative is the Conservatives will openly fornicate corporate Alberta in the middle of the street while a Liberal will do it in the privacy of their own home so nobody can see them do it

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According to some experts the claim to the biggest enviromental disaster in the world goes to Quebec and the massive James Bay Hydro project, build with tax dollars from all Canadians and one of the biggest CO2 emmitters in the world. It needs to be shutdown.

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There is no reality more harsh than knowing that in Alberta we have some of the biggest social problems affecting families and individuals, and the government wants to do nothing about it.

Meanwhile the concentration of wealth continues, the living standards of the middle class are degrading and the ranks of the poor are growing. All this is happening during a massive economic boom, and not just the government but most of the opposition party's desire to make no move at all toward actually addressing the pressing social issues to the forefront of a public agenda during an election. Those partisan groups seek to hold political power and govern the citizens but have no desire to stand up and take action to ease the burdens of over taxation and crushing economic realities.

A sad commentary on those who desire to lead.

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There is no reality more harsh than knowing that in Alberta we have some of the biggest social problems affecting families and individuals, and the government wants to do nothing about it.

Meanwhile the concentration of wealth continues, the living standards of the middle class are degrading and the ranks of the poor are growing. All this is happening during a massive economic boom, and not just the government but most of the opposition party's desire to make no move at all toward actually addressing the pressing social issues to the forefront of a public agenda during an election. Those partisan groups seek to hold political power and govern the citizens but have no desire to stand up and take action to ease the burdens of over taxation and crushing economic realities.

A sad commentary on those who desire to lead.

We're doing great as ouarer most of our friends. Never had it so good as the last decade or so.

Why not start your own party and tell people that they should all be unhappy. Anyways, off to COP for a days skiing with thousands of other oppressed Albertans. Monday off to Nakiska to wallow among the forced laughter of other thousands spending their dough and not knowing they are actually miserable .

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I like how everyone thinks that because Alberta has money, we must be miserable. I don't know about this. I feel alot more enthusiasm and optimism for the future sitting in meetings in Calgary than in Montreal or Toronto. People in Calgary are far more optimistic and excited about life than anyone in Winnipeg or Windsor.

Having money doesn't make you unhappy. It may not be the fundamental ingredient in being happy, but Albertans have alot going for them from any perspective.

Everything isn't perfect, but it's pretty damn good. Despite being in an oppresive Canadian business climate, Alberta is still one of the richest regions in the world. We're doing very good. No need for change. If you want the government to start handing out everything to you, go to Quebec or the Maritimes. It's not the way we do things here. We don't want you.

Jerry, why do you look to the government to solve issues between individuals and families? What else do you want the government to do for you?

Bayman, tution rates have been frozen here for years, they have not increased at all since I started in University 4 years ago. And with some very minor exceptions (two ridings come to mind), provincial boundaries accurately reflect population distribution.

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I like how everyone thinks that because Alberta has money, we must be miserable. I don't know about this. I feel alot more enthusiasm and optimism for the future sitting in meetings in Calgary than in Montreal or Toronto. People in Calgary are far more optimistic and excited about life than anyone in Winnipeg or Windsor.

Having money doesn't make you unhappy. It may not be the fundamental ingredient in being happy, but Albertans have alot going for them from any perspective.

Everything isn't perfect, but it's pretty damn good. Despite being in an oppresive Canadian business climate, Alberta is still one of the richest regions in the world. We're doing very good. No need for change. If you want the government to start handing out everything to you, go to Quebec or the Maritimes. It's not the way we do things here. We don't want you.

Jerry, why do you look to the government to solve issues between individuals and families? What else do you want the government to do for you?

Bayman, tution rates have been frozen here for years, they have not increased at all since I started in University 4 years ago. And with some very minor exceptions (two ridings come to mind), provincial boundaries accurately reflect population distribution.

What I want is the government to leave me and my family alone. I want to be able to determine my own fate, I don't want help from the government at all. All that I desire from the Government of Alberta is to leave Canada and reduce my tax load. The so called boom has inflated the hell out of the monthly budget, and I see no reduction in taxation. The problem in Alberta is the reduced amount of disposable income for families and individuals. Granted business is doing well, and there are the wealthy few who have reaped great benefit from the rise in economic activity. Don't get me wrong here the citizens have benefited from increased employment. However there is always a down side to wild swings in the economy.

In the present situation, my children will have a hell of a time trying to buy a home. Real wages have not gone up very much, and the big employment bucks exist way the hell out of town. Our infrastructure is crumbling and we still haven't seen the return of funding for all the cuts made in social programs to pay off our provincial debt.

Meanwhile the government and the political parties fail to realize that for the average guy or family in Alberta things have simply got more expensive. It isn't getting cheaper to live it is getting more expensive to live. The only way around the problem is to increase the disposable income of citizens, and that means tax deduction.

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What I want is the government to leave me and my family alone. I want to be able to determine my own fate, I don't want help from the government at all. All that I desire from the Government of Alberta is to leave Canada and reduce my tax load. The so called boom has inflated the hell out of the monthly budget, and I see no reduction in taxation. The problem in Alberta is the reduced amount of disposable income for families and individuals. Granted business is doing well, and there are the wealthy few who have reaped great benefit from the rise in economic activity. Don't get me wrong here the citizens have benefited from increased employment. However there is always a down side to wild swings in the economy.

In the present situation, my children will have a hell of a time trying to buy a home. Real wages have not gone up very much, and the big employment bucks exist way the hell out of town. Our infrastructure is crumbling and we still haven't seen the return of funding for all the cuts made in social programs to pay off our provincial debt.

Meanwhile the government and the political parties fail to realize that for the average guy or family in Alberta things have simply got more expensive. It isn't getting cheaper to live it is getting more expensive to live. The only way around the problem is to increase the disposable income of citizens, and that means tax deduction.

Not us. We're doing great. Never been better. My 18 year old nephew just arrived in alberta. no skills. He worked a 10 shift today at time and a half and earned just under $300. He pays the lowest provincial taxes in Canada and used today's gravy cheque to buy an electric guitar with no provincial sales tax. He's happy as a pig in mud compared to his prospects in the Maritimes.

You need to get out of Alberta more and see the real world. hint: people are flocking to Alberta nad not the other way around. And yes, all those thousands of houses & condos being built are being bought by resourceful and hard working young couples. Do those folks have magical properties...nope, they aen't negative no-can-doers.

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Not us. We're doing great. Never been better. My 18 year old nephew just arrived in alberta. no skills. He worked a 10 shift today at time and a half and earned just under $300. He pays the lowest provincial taxes in Canada and used today's gravy cheque to buy an electric guitar with no provincial sales tax. He's happy as a pig in mud compared to his prospects in the Maritimes.

You need to get out of Alberta more and see the real world. hint: people are flocking to Alberta nad not the other way around. And yes, all those thousands of houses & condos being built are being bought by resourceful and hard working young couples. Do those folks have magical properties...nope, they aen't negative no-can-doers.

So ask your nephew how he feels when he thinks about buying a house, well young man here's a $500,000 house that you need to save up $50,000 to make a down payment on just to have a mortgage under $2000 a month. I work as hard as anybody and made $106,000 last year it's just that I would like to see my levels of public services stay the same or improve after paying $32,000 in taxes. Would like to see university students paying less for tuition then the rest of the country because we are the richest province in Canada. Would like to see our most vulnerable residents in seniors and the disabled have their rents frozen or their AISH levels tied to the levels of inflation. Our retirees deserve respect for building this province not to be kicked aside because they never envisioned a runaway economy rendering them incapable of keeping up. Ireland decided that university would be free and for years now have been called the Celtic Tiger of european economies. I am glad your nephew came out here from the maritimes, so did I 22 years ago from Newfoundland. I have seen the rest of Canada and I have travelled to many places in the world and that is the reason I am applying for a visa to work in Europe. Europeans work to live not live to work like the vast majority of people in Alberta. Keep in mind that the rise of the Canadian dollar is what is killing the manufacturing basin in southern Ontario and that is why they are "flocking to Alberta". Ask how many are planning to retire here and that would be a better question. 60,000 temporary foreign workers who are being abused and lied to by employers and brokerage firms, seniors and students unable to make ends meet, our young people having to live at home until they are thirty because they can't afford to move out. Not to mention Fort McMurray being an environmental catastrophe with more and more rubber stamps being issued to oil projects. Not to mention the fact that instead of refining raw bitumen here in Alberta and keeping Canadians in jobs we are shipping it via the "Alberta clipper" and "gateway" pipelines to the American midwest so they can make more money off our own resource from the finished product then we do. Alberta does have its advantages we desperately need to take stewardship of our own resources and get a social conscience for gods sake.

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Well Bayman, it seems as if you actually understand the situation. Many Albertans cannot, for reasons that escape me. While we all know how good it is here, we don't really know how bad it is here.

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So ask your nephew how he feels when he thinks about buying a house, well young man here's a $500,000 house that you need to save up $50,000 to make a down payment on just to have a mortgage under $2000 a month.

An 18year old doesn't need the presuure of buying a house. We didn't buy our first modest home until we were in our mid 20's.

Our son and daughter in law saved $170,000 working 18 months in the oilpatch at Rainbow Lake. It's called makng the efort and setting a goal. Houses are built in record numbers. Who do you think are buying them? Alberta has the lowest average age of homeownership in the 10 provinces. Hint: the highest average age is where there is the least opportunity.

The answer to being a loser is not starting to save the 50,000 and giving up. How did thousands of Albertans in their 20's buy a house last year? It seems every week in our company someone is announcing buying their home.

Edited by oreodontist

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An 18year old doesn't need the presuure of buying a house. We didn't buy our first modest home until we were in our mid 20's.

Our son and daughter in law saved $170,000 working 18 months in the oilpatch at Rainbow Lake. It's called makng the efort and setting a goal. Houses are built in record numbers. Who do you think are buying them? Alberta has the lowest average age of homeownership in the 10 provinces. Hint: the highest average age is where there is the least opportunity.

The answer to being a loser is not starting to save the 50,000 and giving up. How did thousands of Albertans in their 20's buy a house last year? It seems every week in our company someone is announcing buying their home.

Congrats you picked one aspect out of that letter how about seniors? how about refining oil in Alberta as opposed to the American midwest so we can keep Canadians in jobs, not Americans! Thats great that your son and daughter went through law and saved money at Rainbow Lake how about if university was free, or better yet huge scholarships were awarded based on academic standing instead of having to waist 18 months in snap lake in the first place? That way they would graduate 18 months earlier and already be practicing law. Its called a long term strategy to invest in your future and diversify you economy. This provinces economy is tied to one resource ask yourself how easy would it have been for them to save $180,000 dollars if the OPEC flooded the market and oil was $21.00 a barrel. The answer to that question is a no-brainer. The problem is there are NO plans in this province for the day this happens. Those who lived through the early 80's in Alberta know that besides NEP world oil prices dropped through the floor and left this province at a standstill. Would love to have seen them at that time save up enough for law school. Saying that if you are a loser because you haven't tried to save money to buy a home is a LOSER statement. Not EVERYONE in Alberta is working in the oil patch, not everyone can and saying "seems like there is someone buying a house in our company every week" is just plain ignorant. How about making life easier for people not harder, there are quality of life issues. A human being has only so many years in their lives should all of it be based on working 10, 12, 14 hour workdays. Albertans put more working hours in then any other countries in the G-8 and low and behold they have the highest rate of divorce out of all G-8 nations. I remember sitting around the table at the start of my career in Fort McMurray listening to the # one conversation at the lunch table I can hear it now " Man I gotta pay her $1000.00 a month in childcare" well maybe that's because you work a hundred hours a week fool! She left you because the only time you see her is when you are in bed and you are useless to her. The oil fields themselves have created huge issues for families, astronomical rates of booze and drug addiction, fathers who don't see their families 6 months of the year. This is the story for thousands of workers in the tarsands, look at studies being done by both the Fraser Institute and Parkland Institute, they don't paint as rosy a picture as you think. A very good friend of mine just finished doing a study commissioned by the Alberta government on addiction rates in the oil patch and the results were HORRIFIC! The social ramifications of an economy on steroids are astronomical! Again how do we deal with this problems? There is NO plan for this under the current regime of Tories

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Bayman, since you are so down on Alberta even though you didn't move here until 1986, why don't you move the hell back home? This is not the east coast and Albertans don't want the government to hand out everything they need on a silver spoon. YOU are the reason this province has become so damn liberal. Before you NDP people started moving here we had a nice thing going. Do you remember WHY you moved to Alberta? Why don't you tell us? Did you get the nomination to run for the NDP or did you get the cushy non-working union boss job in Ft. Mac? Or both?

Albertans pay far too much in tax to support the rest of Canada (as always, Ontario excepted) and what we should be doing is adopting a Kwebek-like immigration policy. If we don't like you, you don't get in. If we only MOSTLY don't like you but we have a job for you, you get a temporary work visa. If you're our kind of person and you're a good fit in the province, you can stay. You said it yourself: How many of these Canadian immigrants are going to stay once retired? Then again, who cares? Work and then get out.

Pierre Elliot Stelmach and his band of cronies need to get their asses handed to them on election day. We all know they will still be the government, I (and others) just wish it were a one or two seat majority that would allow the party to kick Eddie' ass out of the chair.

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Congrats you picked one aspect out of that letter how about seniors? how about refining oil in Alberta as opposed to the American midwest so we can keep Canadians in jobs, not Americans! Thats great that your son and daughter went through law and saved money at Rainbow Lake how about if university was free, or better yet huge scholarships were awarded based on academic standing instead of having to waist 18 months in snap lake in the first place? That way they would graduate 18 months earlier and already be practicing law. Its called a long term strategy to invest in your future and diversify you economy. This provinces economy is tied to one resource ask yourself how easy would it have been for them to save $180,000 dollars if the OPEC flooded the market and oil was $21.00 a barrel. The answer to that question is a no-brainer. The problem is there are NO plans in this province for the day this happens. Those who lived through the early 80's in Alberta know that besides NEP world oil prices dropped through the floor and left this province at a standstill. Would love to have seen them at that time save up enough for law school. Saying that if you are a loser because you haven't tried to save money to buy a home is a LOSER statement. Not EVERYONE in Alberta is working in the oil patch, not everyone can and saying "seems like there is someone buying a house in our company every week" is just plain ignorant. How about making life easier for people not harder, there are quality of life issues. A human being has only so many years in their lives should all of it be based on working 10, 12, 14 hour workdays. Albertans put more working hours in then any other countries in the G-8 and low and behold they have the highest rate of divorce out of all G-8 nations. I remember sitting around the table at the start of my career in Fort McMurray listening to the # one conversation at the lunch table I can hear it now " Man I gotta pay her $1000.00 a month in childcare" well maybe that's because you work a hundred hours a week fool! She left you because the only time you see her is when you are in bed and you are useless to her. The oil fields themselves have created huge issues for families, astronomical rates of booze and drug addiction, fathers who don't see their families 6 months of the year. This is the story for thousands of workers in the tarsands, look at studies being done by both the Fraser Institute and Parkland Institute, they don't paint as rosy a picture as you think. A very good friend of mine just finished doing a study commissioned by the Alberta government on addiction rates in the oil patch and the results were HORRIFIC! The social ramifications of an economy on steroids are astronomical! Again how do we deal with this problems? There is NO plan for this under the current regime of Tories

Cripes, are you a negative nabob. Forget the Prozac today? :blink: Why not just shoot yourself? Then again, you'd start bitchin about the government not handing out free guns and having to pay for the bullet yourself.

I apologize for my family and friends having a good life and not joining you in the crybaby game. :rolleyes:

Edited by oreodontist

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Bayman, since you are so down on Alberta even though you didn't move here until 1986, why don't you move the hell back home? This is not the east coast and Albertans don't want the government to hand out everything they need on a silver spoon. YOU are the reason this province has become so damn liberal. Before you NDP people started moving here we had a nice thing going. Do you remember WHY you moved to Alberta? Why don't you tell us? Did you get the nomination to run for the NDP or did you get the cushy non-working union boss job in Ft. Mac? Or both?

Albertans pay far too much in tax to support the rest of Canada (as always, Ontario excepted) and what we should be doing is adopting a Kwebek-like immigration policy. If we don't like you, you don't get in. If we only MOSTLY don't like you but we have a job for you, you get a temporary work visa. If you're our kind of person and you're a good fit in the province, you can stay. You said it yourself: How many of these Canadian immigrants are going to stay once retired? Then again, who cares? Work and then get out.

Pierre Elliot Stelmach and his band of cronies need to get their asses handed to them on election day. We all know they will still be the government, I (and others) just wish it were a one or two seat majority that would allow the party to kick Eddie' ass out of the chair.

Actually moved here in 1980 so I was a little off in my calculations. I am home its called CANADA jackass. I have never had anything handed to me on a silver platter and my day job is working in the heavy equipment industry NOT a cushy union official job. Alberta can't adopt a Quebec style immigration policy because they signed the constitution in 1982, which begs the question do you even understand the constitution of the COUNTRY you live in, not the province. I am thanking god there are more easterners here and that this place is changing, it desperately needed to. Oh and to use your own words, you don't like the atmosphere here then you can also move to a COUNTRY down south called the United States where it seems you would fit in much better. Albertans paying taxes to support the rest of Canada hmmm Alberta is in Canada, we are Canadians NOT Albertans and thank god for that. Easterners came out here in large part to WORK not get everything handed to them on a silver spoon, that's why we are here, if we wanted government hand outs we would still be back home. Which is where most of us are going when our working years are done anyways it is people such as yourself that confirms the need for more change in here in the first place. Oh and Alberta doesn't need an immigration policy they just ship in 60,000 disposable workers from asia and then our bitumen south of the border to get refined. So lets see you are right you had a good thing going here, lets harken back to those good old days of Earnest Manning and the boys sterilizing the mentally challenged so they couldn't reproduce!!!! Good old Earnest now there was a progressive. Why don't you go grab a wad of cha, sit down with your bucket, sit down with some tobacco chewing red neck buddies and have a cool one served to you by a temporary foreign worker. You know what should make you happy while you do that is the prospect that more and more of us are coming, Alberta will change whether it likes it or not, and your ways will be DONE!!! and there is NOTHING you can do about it, so put that in your pipe and smoke it!

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Alberta has changed. Alberta will continue to change. The citizens of this province are very hard working and they have become apathetic to government. Their will has not impact government policy because they have chosen not to participate in the political process. That to will change, and when it does the government will change.

For now, folks need to just hold on. Hold on and go for the ride. Keep working and start talking to our friends and family about the problems in this province. We need to take politics to the cafe's and skating rinks. We need to abandon apathy for action. When we do that we can write our own ticket.

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Cripes, are you a negative nabob. Forget the Prozac today? :blink: Why not just shoot yourself? Then again, you'd start bitchin about the government not handing out free guns and having to pay for the bullet yourself.

I apologize for my family and friends having a good life and not joining you in the crybaby game. :rolleyes:

Crybaby game what? The government has handed me NOTHING nor do I want it to, you are missing the point, neither your family or yourself should say sorry for anything. I have also worked for everything I have and haven't had the government hand me anything. The point I am trying to make here is not hand out higher payments for people on social assistance, not increase unemployment insurance rates, not giving away anything, the point I am trying to make is that while we are successful there are a large minority of people who are not, and that this success comes with costs. Now that our books are balanced and we are moving into an era of savings and restructuring why would we not start investing our money in a constructive way towards the two facets of society that are the benchmarks of any democracy, healthcare and education. I have never thought of myself a Newfoundlander or an Albertan first, I have always thought of myself first and foremost as a Canadian. I am not saying that Alberta is a terrible place, that is another widely held misconception of those sitting on the right. I enjoy my weekends in Jasper, Banff and other places in the province, as a person who's job has lead me to live in Fort McMurray, Edmonton, Red Deer, Calgary, and Grand Prairie I can honestly say that I admire the optimism in Alberta. I admire the opportunities in Alberta, the point I am trying to make is that there is a social deficit here that just like our financial debt also needs to be balanced. I apologize for coming off so acidic, I am sure you along with your family are good people with great intentions, it just becomes a knee-jerk reaction when you sit on the left end of the spectrum to come out swinging because you have to have a pretty thick skin to be on the left in Alberta. I would say good luck to you and your family and again will try and structure the debate in a more constructive fashion.

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I suppose Bayman, you also subscribe to the idea that Alberta's resources belong to Canada as well. You really shouldn't be too darn proud to crow about an illegitimate document like Trudeau and Chretien's Charter and Canada Act. A document that was never ratified by Canadian Voter's. It really does show how ignorant you are of History and the facts. The sooner Alberta quits supporting the failed Sociliast Dreams of Trudeau the Commie Ass Kisser the better.

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I suppose Bayman, you also subscribe to the idea that Alberta's resources belong to Canada as well. You really shouldn't be too darn proud to crow about an illegitimate document like Trudeau and Chretien's Charter and Canada Act. A document that was never ratified by Canadian Voter's. It really does show how ignorant you are of History and the facts. The sooner Alberta quits supporting the failed Sociliast Dreams of Trudeau the Commie Ass Kisser the better.

Actually if you read the original BNA it does give the power over "trade and commerce" to the federal government, the only resources the provinces had power over and I quote were "The Management and Sale of the Public Lands belonging to the Province and of the Timber and Wood thereon". The BNA act says nothing about Alberta or any province having control over any of their other resources. Seems as though when the Canadian government purchased Alberta from the Hudson's Bay Company that it fell under the section of the BNA that stated "The Public Debt and Property" meaning that that land was Canada's and Alberta did not exist at that time. After the province was formed the federal government handed over what was to become Alberta and the modern day tarsands were in the NWT, it is only after the boundaries were drawn out again that Alberta finally was given by the feds the land the current tarsands resides on. So upon Canada's birth as a nation that land was CROWN land belonging to the country. It is through the the 82' constitution that official recognition of the provinces controlling their own resources was acknowledged by the feds.

The 1982 act "- The fourth big change made by the Constitution Act, 1982, gives the provinces wide powers over their natural resources. Each province will now be able to control the export, to any other part of Canada, of the primary production from its mines, oil wells, gas wells, forests and electric power plants, provided it does not discriminate against other parts of Canada in prices or supplies. But the national Parliament will still be able to legislate on these matters, and if provincial and federal laws conflict, the federal will prevail. The provinces will also be able to levy indirect taxes on their mines, oil wells, gas wells, forests and electric power plants and primary production from these sources. But such taxes must be the same for products exported to other parts of Canada and products not so exported"

I think if anyone is ignorant of the history of this country or the facts about natural resources it's YOU! Read before you speak and compare and contrast the Constitution and the BNA act before you speak to others about what they do or do not know. Seems to me you need some better research skills and on top of that the very document you hate is the one that granted the provinces the right to control their own oil. Oh and how I love the fact that all socialists are commies, does that mean I get to call you a fascist now. Drop the name calling and get educated!

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It makes me laugh to see Alberta citizens chomp at the bit to swing the ideology axe around. What an utter waste of time, this is just what both the right and left wingnuts want folks to do. They lay claim to the truth, but the truth doesn't recognize this political partisan clap trap.

Albertans need to grow up and grow a pair along with the spine to carry them around. Maybe at some point we can grow a freaking brain while we are at it and realize that what we really need cannot be found within the current system of things. Those resources are owned by the citizens of Alberta, not the government of Alberta and certainly not the government of Canada. The huge budget created at the Provincial Legislature is spending Alberta citizens tax dollars, not Canadian tax dollars. Canada grafts another billion dollars a month from Alberta citizens in federal taxes more than what they return to us in programs and services.

Most of the vocal citizens in this province are very partisan and very right wing. That is unfortunate, yet this forum and perhaps others invite all citizens to participate in discussion. Much of the media is split up with some swinging left and some swinging right, that is not helpful either when there is no middle ground. The middle is where most folks want to be, but many people don't like that. Many folks think you need to be on one side or the other and claim that folks that do not are fence sitting as if it were some kind of disease. These are the same folks that cannot understand the apathy that exists within our system.

It is my hope that after this election is over that folks will see that nothing much will have changed and their hopes and dreams of improvements will be dashed against the rocks of ideological elitism. I actually want those hopes crushed to make those folks see the reality of the political situation in our province. Our problems are not simply left and right differences, they are far more complex and far more difficult to overcome than most people think. The only way to solve the problems can be found by citizens as long as we put partisan politics aside. Until we put them aside we will be mired ideological differences instead of addressing the issues.

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It makes me laugh to see Alberta citizens chomp at the bit to swing the ideology axe around. What an utter waste of time, this is just what both the right and left wingnuts want folks to do. They lay claim to the truth, but the truth doesn't recognize this political partisan clap trap.

Albertans need to grow up and grow a pair along with the spine to carry them around. Maybe at some point we can grow a freaking brain while we are at it and realize that what we really need cannot be found within the current system of things. Those resources are owned by the citizens of Alberta, not the government of Alberta and certainly not the government of Canada. The huge budget created at the Provincial Legislature is spending Alberta citizens tax dollars, not Canadian tax dollars. Canada grafts another billion dollars a month from Alberta citizens in federal taxes more than what they return to us in programs and services.

Most of the vocal citizens in this province are very partisan and very right wing. That is unfortunate, yet this forum and perhaps others invite all citizens to participate in discussion. Much of the media is split up with some swinging left and some swinging right, that is not helpful either when there is no middle ground. The middle is where most folks want to be, but many people don't like that. Many folks think you need to be on one side or the other and claim that folks that do not are fence sitting as if it were some kind of disease. These are the same folks that cannot understand the apathy that exists within our system.

It is my hope that after this election is over that folks will see that nothing much will have changed and their hopes and dreams of improvements will be dashed against the rocks of ideological elitism. I actually want those hopes crushed to make those folks see the reality of the political situation in our province. Our problems are not simply left and right differences, they are far more complex and far more difficult to overcome than most people think. The only way to solve the problems can be found by citizens as long as we put partisan politics aside. Until we put them aside we will be mired ideological differences instead of addressing the issues.

I am not going to disagree with you, obviously if I had to define myself I would be considered leftist to that there is no doubt. However I will say that there are several aspects of conservatism I agree with. I am not for a state ran economy, I do believe in a free enterprise and capitalism, but not running unchecked, and not having all the influence in the political tent. To be non-partisan such as yourself is a healthy thing. Barack Obama is fairing well in the Democratic primaries in the US based on exactly what you are talking about. He has and is reaching out to the Republicans to find a middle ground. Again this is a good thing, as he puts it "these are not a series of Red States and Blue States, these are the United States of America". He is bang on when he says that and in too many circumstances the Liberals have won elections running up the middle between right and left. Lester Pearson made fantastic strides in a minority government with that kind of non-partisan approach. He negotiated the Canada Pension Plan, and laid the foundations of universal health care in this country. I will admit it is a fault of mine to fall into that ideological trap when faced with it. What you speak of resonates with the green party who run a platform based on the notion that right and left politics get nothing done anymore and they are wrong the problem is that as the system stands right and left is what we are confronted with. I am not saying I would not be willing to work with a Conservative I would actually rather work with them then to work with the modern day political windsock known as the Liberal party. They stand fr nothing, if the winds blow in one direction of the other you'll find a Liberal with his finger in the air running with the wind. I also like many on this site make a good living and my family is well taken care of, the difference is I think there is a social responsibility we have as citizens that we are miserably failing at. Reagonomics and the "trickle-down" theory failed miserably, now America is paying the price. We need a better system and when the Alberta government formed "all parties" task forces on housing, seniors, and royalties I thought we were moving in the right direction. When they ignored the results of those task forces because they didn't like the answers then it lead me to believe it was back to politics as usual in Alberta and became very frustrated. I actually do tend to be more moderate then I am expressing in here just enjoy the "devils advocate" and "sucking them in" approach for my own good sometimes. LOL

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Sorry for all the typing errors LOL just I a have been working on two things at once here all day. Writing an academic paper on the challenges faced by unions when confronted with multi-national corporations. However I will endeavor to argue with a less personal approach and make things a little more academic, unless of course I get that "axe" swung at me, then I'm swinging back LOL

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On the Project Alberta forum (http://www.projectalberta.com/) I myself am labeled a socialist. I am nowhere near that little corner but those folks have painted me in there. I changed my name to Commonwealth over there and received daily beatings from the right wing nuts that reside there. I stay there, and here in Alberta because I really think that the left has some valid points, they care about people not things. In Alberta after four decades of Tory rule we are finally about to turn a corner. It won't happen this election but it will happen the next one, then the Tories will have the same status as Social Credit.

In the richest province of the nation we have, to borrow a social credit phrase, "poverty in the midst of plenty". There is just no other way to describe the situation. Folks have made a lot of money with their small businesses catering to oil company's and they want to make even more. They are the vocal ones in Alberta. The real majority here is totally apathetic to politics, and their numbers are greater than all the others put together, well almost anyway. That single demographic is the one that will rise and bite them in the ass, and they won't see it coming.

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On the Project Alberta forum (http://www.projectalberta.com/) I myself am labeled a socialist. I am nowhere near that little corner but those folks have painted me in there. I changed my name to Commonwealth over there and received daily beatings from the right wing nuts that reside there. I stay there, and here in Alberta because I really think that the left has some valid points, they care about people not things. In Alberta after four decades of Tory rule we are finally about to turn a corner. It won't happen this election but it will happen the next one, then the Tories will have the same status as Social Credit.

In the richest province of the nation we have, to borrow a social credit phrase, "poverty in the midst of plenty". There is just no other way to describe the situation. Folks have made a lot of money with their small businesses catering to oil company's and they want to make even more. They are the vocal ones in Alberta. The real majority here is totally apathetic to politics, and their numbers are greater than all the others put together, well almost anyway. That single demographic is the one that will rise and bite them in the ass, and they won't see it coming.

I agree with you about demographics, what percentage of Albertans actually vote? I know in the last civic election in Edmonton is was under 40% which is ridiculous. When those who don't vote finally realize they are the ones that will change the face of Alberta I think everybody here including myself will be surprised at the results. Recent polling suggests that 52% of voting Albertans will vote Conservative, that means that with very little over half the vote in Alberta they will have a majority. I think it is time to talk about proportional representation, it is the only system we have that is truly reflective of society. Then you really would see the green party with seats federally and provincially which I think is only fair. That won't happen for a long time though because Tories recognize the fact they would get ousted far more easily in a more democratic system then this "first past the post" garbage we have now. Minority governments work as far as I'm concerned nobody has a dominating agenda and they are forced to actually work to put legislation through. The problem is the same with the federal senate, instead of it having to be a patronage appointment by the government of the day, why not make it a triple E senate? That was one reform idea I actually thought was good. But just like Ontario and Quebec being unwilling to give up power in the senate, Tories here are unwilling to look at proportional representation because they realize it spells certain doom for them. I stay in Alberta because someone once asked me "why do you stay here feeling the way you do?" I simply replied that as a lefty in Canada this is where the fight is. This is ground zero and that's just where I like it, why run from a fight when you can continue to have one daily.

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