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Teachers brainwashing our children?


Mr.Canada

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Anytime i hear about the causes of homosexuality they always say that is caused by biological and/or environmental factors.

But the "homosexuality is a choice" thing is just bogus. Putting your pinker in another guy's stinker is a choice, liking it is not.

All your "theories" and assumptions are based on hunches. You should look into actual scientific research studies done on the subject, for which i'm sure there are tons. Wikipedia is NOT a scholarly source.

Homosexuality is just another sexual fetish like s and m, some might call it deviant. I don't necessarily. If there is tons of scientific evidence out there then why can't these people who disagree with me provide some? It should be rather easy since there is "tons" out there.

I've looked and have been unable to find any that states, unequivocally and undeniably, that homosexuality is caused by a abnormality in any gene or chromosome. Or because of X reason.

I'm the first person to admit it when I'm wrong. If I am I'll always say so. Until then I still say that if God must stay out so should any pseudo scientific "facts".

Saying that homosexuals should be treated as fairly as any other person in our society is one thing, which I happen to agree with. However don't try to tell us that being a homosexual is a natural, biological phenomena destined at birth or through the coarse of ones life. It simply isn't.

People have been married for years, have kids and the like then get divorced and start having sex with a member of the same sex. Happens all the time. That person made a choice to marry a member of the opposite sex then decided to have sex with a member of the same sex. It's all personal choice.

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... I believe in God, some people do not, all fine and good, whatever. I have never seen God yet I know God exists. This is the exact same thing. There is no proof that people are biologically homosexual you just believe it to be true.

As a Christian, please point out the chapter and verse where Jesus directly says anything about homosexuality.

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I've read that before and it isn't conclusive at all. It's all just a theory. There is no empirical proof out there.

But it is a start, and it profoundly suggests that genetic factors are part of the equation.

At any rate, it is somewhat better than your "evidence," which is zero, and is based purely on your personal antipathy to homosexuality.

You asked for citations, for evidence. But you were also asked for citations and evidence yourself.

Why not provide some?

As for your molestation "theory": as another poster pointed out, the vast majority of girls who are molested are molested by men. So how does that account for lesbianism?

Edited by bloodyminded
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Homosexuality is just another sexual fetish like s and m, some might call it deviant. I don't necessarily. If there is tons of scientific evidence out there then why can't these people who disagree with me provide some? It should be rather easy since there is "tons" out there.

I'll simply point out to a recent posting by bitsy.
People have been married for years, have kids and the like then get divorced and start having sex with a member of the same sex. Happens all the time. That person made a choice to marry a member of the opposite sex then decided to have sex with a member of the same sex. It's all personal choice.

Some people deny who they are for part of their life, and realize who they are. How people deal with their sexual orientation is a matter of choice. The sexual orientation itself is not a matter of choice.

BTW, here's a scientific discovery pointing in that direction:

Two Canadian researchers have found a link between the number of ridges in fingerprints and male homosexuality, adding to the theory that sexual orientation is determined before birth.

The researchers, working at the University of Western Ontario, compared the number of tiny ridges on the fingertips of 66 homosexual men with the fingerprint patterns of 182 heterosexual men.Thirty percent of the homosexual men showed more ridges on their left hands than their right, while only 14 percent of the heterosexual men showed the same pattern.

Most men and women have more ridges in the fingerprints of their right hands. Fingerprints are completely developed in human fetuses by about the 16th week after conception.

"This certainly suggests sexual orientation is somehow determined by prenatal events," said researcher Doreen Kimura.

From the Deseret News, 1995

Of course, you are free to argue that gay men alter there fingertips when they choose to become gay.

Edited by CANADIEN
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I've read that before and it isn't conclusive at all. It's all just a theory. There is no empirical proof out there.

Pulled right from the wiki you gave me.

If God cannot be in the public classroom then all this homosexuality is biological stuff shouldn't be allowed either since neither can be proven.

Oh, I know what the wiki article says, but it says something and it shows there is active scientific research being done on the question. But that is hardly the good part of my post.

The good part is me asking you what your theory is. Because you are asking for scientic proof, I want to know what your scientific theory is - or any theory for that matter - so we can compare it to the scientific research currently being undertaken.

So please tell me what your theory of 'why homosexuality' so we can compare it, in the open, for all to see how it stacks up.

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Homosexuality is just another sexual fetish like s and m, some might call it deviant.

Again, do you have any evidence to back this up?

I've looked and have been unable to find any that states, unequivocally and undeniably, that homosexuality is caused by a abnormality in any gene or chromosome. Or because of X reason.

We can argue the causes of homosexuality. However, the heart of what i disagreed with in your earlier post is that homosexuality is a "choice". Again, the homosexual acts are a choice (as are heterosexual acts are), but the desire isn't.

I heard this statistic today from a social worker on television: In Ottawa, 1 in 4 males from the ages of 15-24 who commit suicide are identified to have been gay. This is evidence that many of these males didn't want to be gay, and in fact the situation disturbed them or their lives so much that they decided to kill themselves. There's stricter gender norms for males than females, ie: social pressure to "be a man" and be tough or whatever.

I just don't know of many people, male or female, who would "want" to gay, or transgender or whatever. It's a damn tough road, especially as a teenager, to go through all the social stigma, parental shame/scorn etc.

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I just don't know of many people, male or female, who would "want" to gay, or transgender or whatever. It's a damn tough road, especially as a teenager, to go through all the social stigma, parental shame/scorn etc.

Pretty sad state of affairs indeed. Being a teen is tough as it is with all the societal pressures. If they are gay, then they are gay. Why do people have a problem with how others are in their sexuality? My guess is that those who say being gay is a choice are struggling with their own dilema about their own sexuality.

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My guess is that those who say being gay is a choice are struggling with their own dilema about their own sexuality.

Right. No one really knows if they are gay or not. Even if you think you are not gay you still might be gay. Some people don't find out until later in life that they are gay and I guess some people never find out and live life being straight.

No one knows who else may be gay either. No one can tell.

It really helps to make homosexuality so open and accepted. We can even try it out if we are tempted and there would be nothing wrong with that. If you don't want to try it out I guess you aren't gay but can you really be sure because maybe you think that way because your Mom would be devastated.

It's a very tricky thing. I can't wait til science finally settles it and we can tell if we are gay or not and if someone else is gay.

One thing for sure if you are gay then I imagine you like gay sex - whatever that entails. I suppose it would help to know if you were gay if you knew what they do. Then you would have some kind of barometer to tell if you were gay or not. When I think about it, french kissing somehow loses it's appeal.

Anyway your statement, which contradicts your first statement, that if you are gay you are gay, is one that is designed to place doubt in heterosexual individuals as to their sexual orientaton. Most of us know if we are or not and we don't have to try it in order to know.

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Anyway your statement, which contradicts your first statement, that if you are gay you are gay, is one that is designed to place doubt in heterosexual individuals as to their sexual orientaton. Most of us know if we are or not and we don't have to try it in order to know.

Sure many who are gay, know they are gay. Then there are some who are struggling to find out if they are gay or not. Those are the people I think that sometimes speak the loudest against being gay because they are not even sure about their own sexuality. They might not want to be gay or like the fact they are gay, but they are what they are, can't be changed because it's not a choice.

That is what I am referring to.

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Sure many who are gay, know they are gay. Then there are some who are struggling to find out if they are gay or not. Those are the people I think that sometimes speak the loudest against being gay because they are not even sure about their own sexuality. They might not want to be gay or like the fact they are gay, but they are what they are, can't be changed because it's not a choice.

That is what I am referring to.

This is typical socialist society training. Engineered to shut down all conversation on a certain subject.

So anyone who criticizes any aspect of homosexual life is probably gay or a homophobe? That's rich GH.

The same way anyone who criticizes immigration is a racist. Criticize Islam, you're Islamaphobe. Want to cut spending? You want unions to stop holding the public hostage ever few years? You're a right wing fascist like Hitler.

This is the way the socialist mind works. They wish to shut down all conversation on any given subject. Watch out for it...they are a cunning enemy.

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This is typical socialist society training. Engineered to shut down all conversation on a certain subject.

So anyone who criticizes any aspect of homosexual life is probably gay or a homophobe? That's rich GH.

Nice of you to assume for me. And it's not even worth the time clarifying my position on this for you.

The same way anyone who criticizes immigration is a racist. Criticize Islam, you're Islamaphobe. Want to cut spending? You want unions to stop holding the public hostage ever few years? You're a right wing fascist like Hitler.

No, the style of your postings and sometimes the content itself shut down debate even before you click 'post new topic'. The above quote is a prime example of how to shut down debate.

This is the way the socialist mind works. They wish to shut down all conversation on any given subject. Watch out for it...they are a cunning enemy.

More drivel from you.

Edited by GostHacked
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This is typical socialist society training. Engineered to shut down all conversation on a certain subject.

So anyone who criticizes any aspect of homosexual life is probably gay or a homophobe? That's rich GH.

You are definitely a homophobe. That's not an attempt to stifle debate, it's just a fact, evidenced by your posts on the subject.

Answer cybercoma's question: when did you choose to be straight?

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Nice of you to assume for me. And it's not even worth the time clarifying my position on this for you.

It's exactly what you said. You said that some of the people who speak the loudest against the gay community are gay themselves. Sorry but I don't believe any portion of our society is above criticism or should be immune from criticism.

So I want to know if the same rings true in other parts of society because it is what the left claims to be true.

You are definitely a homophobe. That's not an attempt to stifle debate, it's just a fact, evidenced by your posts on the subject.

I see. I don't think any group should be immune from being criticized in a fashion that doesn't promote hatred. This is how a group becomes a better, more pure version of itself. From taking constant stock of itself and removing parts that may be immoral or unethical and making them pure again.

Edited by Mr.Canada
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He knows damn well he didn't choose to be straight, just like those who are gay don't choose to be gay. It just so happens they are attracted to people of the same sex. And so what if they are? How does it make a damn bit of difference whether a person has a relationship with someone of the same sex or the opposite?

There will be no answers to these questions because Mr. Canada knows he's wrong. He knows he's asking homosexuals to do the exact thing he would likely criticize them for: convert to his sexuality. It's sweet irony that homophobes like Mr. Canada want homosexuals to convert, while simultaneously making the erroneous assumption that homosexuals have some hidden agenda to make society gay. Mr. Canada can't be made gay any more than a gay person is going to be made straight, although the stigma attached to homosexuality has put them in exactly that degrading position.

Edited by cybercoma
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It's exactly what you said. You said that some of the people who speak the loudest against the gay community are gay themselves.

Nice job on reframing my whole statement. I don't beleive you can properly read.

Sorry but I don't believe any portion of our society is above criticism or should be immune from criticism.

Well, I do agree with this statement.

So I want to know if the same rings true in other parts of society because it is what the left claims to be true.

There is no left, there is no right. Both sides make a lot of claims, most of which are wrong. Like the fallacy that being gay is a choice.

I see. I don't think any group should be immune from being criticized in a fashion that doesn't promote hatred. This is how a group becomes a better, more pure version of itself. From taking constant stock of itself and removing parts that may be immoral or unethical and making them pure again.

Ahh I see, you want humanity to be cleansed, now who sounds like a fascist Hitler!! First Muslims, now gays. ... what is next? :D If you take on that killing job, it will be a full time job, because you are always going to have to 'take care' of the gays. Those gays that are not born yet.

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Ahh I see, you want humanity to be cleansed, now who sounds like a fascist Hitler!! First Muslims, now gays. ... what is next? :D If you take on that killing job, it will be a full time job, because you are always going to have to 'take care' of the gays. Those gays that are not born yet.

The improvement of society should always be the goal. If society at large lived cleaner, more wholesome lives we wouldn't have the problems that we now face in our society. Terrorism cannot be allowed to fester and grow. We need to stamp it out whenever it arises. People should be encouraged to lead wholesome, pure lives, lives that enrich a community and not tear it down. As it is now we have people of authority telling kids they can do whatever they want, that the rules do not apply to them. Then they wonder why crime rates are up. They wonder why sexually deviant populations are swelling, growing and outright flourishing in our nearly lawless society.

We need to take back our society from the people who have had control of it since the 1960's. We need to be unapologetic when doing it as well. There's no cure for stupidity but there is for being clueless. Being clueless is becoming more and more dangerous, it's putting us as a society at risk. Common sense needs to return to government, it's been absent for far too long. If the so called 'progressives' don't like it they can move elsewhere where their left wing agenda is embraced. China, Cuba, Vietnam and Laos all have communist governments, perhaps they can go there.

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The improvement of society should always be the goal. If society at large lived cleaner, more wholesome lives we wouldn't have the problems that we now face in our society. Terrorism cannot be allowed to fester and grow. We need to stamp it out whenever it arises. People should be encouraged to lead wholesome, pure lives, lives that enrich a community and not tear it down.

How and why is homosexuality "unwholesome"?

As it is now we have people of authority telling kids they can do whatever they want, that the rules do not apply to them.

No one at all is ever saying any such thing.

We need to take back our society from the people who have had control of it since the 1960's.

Really? I thought you liked Stephen Harper, George W. Bush, Ronald Reagan, Margaret Thatcher, and Franco's political progeney. I thought you respected the powerful men of industry and capital, including those of a conservative persuasion. Conservative Evangelical Christianity seems to be holding strong in North America; arguably stronger than it was a generation ago.

And yes, in many ways the culture's simultaneously becoming more liberal.

But that's because this is how people generally wish it.

The fact is that the approaching normalization of homosexuality in our culture is a triumph of democratic will (as the population tends to be well ahead of political leaders on this issue, among others), and of individual freedoms.

...And what--exactly what--is the problem with the gays, again? You still haven't made it clear.

We need to be unapologetic when doing it as well. There's no cure for stupidity but there is for being clueless. Being clueless is becoming more and more dangerous, it's putting us as a society at risk. Common sense needs to return to government, it's been absent for far too long. If the so called 'progressives' don't like it they can move elsewhere where their left wing agenda is embraced.

According to a MacLean's poll--a poll conducted by Canada's most popular right-of-centre magazine--70% of Canada's population supports same-sex marriage.

That's most of us. By a long shot.

So perhaps it's the so-called conservatives who don't like it--a distinct minority of the population--and perhaps they can move elsewhere where their right-wing agenda is embraced. I propose Saudi Arabia; they don't truck with no gay marriage either!

Edited by bloodyminded
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So anyone who criticizes any aspect of homosexual life is probably gay or a homophobe? That's rich GH.

That's not what he said. Logically, it would be a fallacy to argue that anyone who criticizes any aspect of homosexual life is homophobic or gay. But you are (homophobic, that is).

The same way anyone who criticizes immigration is a racist. Criticize Islam, you're Islamaphobe. Want to cut spending? You want unions to stop holding the public hostage ever few years? You're a right wing fascist like Hitler.

This is the way the socialist mind works. They wish to shut down all conversation on any given subject. Watch out for it...they are a cunning enemy.

You might have a better chance of convincing people to give credence to the little rent above if YOU were not calling for a dictatorship. Edited by CANADIEN
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I see. I don't think any group should be immune from being criticized in a fashion that doesn't promote hatred. This is how a group becomes a better, more pure version of itself. From taking constant stock of itself and removing parts that may be immoral or unethical and making them pure again.

Great idea. Care to demonstrate how it done by purifying yourself from your prejudice and pro-dictatorial tendencies?

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The improvement of society should always be the goal. If society at large lived cleaner, more wholesome lives we wouldn't have the problems that we now face in our society. Terrorism cannot be allowed to fester and grow. We need to stamp it out whenever it arises. People should be encouraged to lead wholesome, pure lives, lives that enrich a community and not tear it down.

Good idea. I'll go one step further, start with yourself.
As it is now we have people of authority telling kids they can do whatever they want, that the rules do not apply to them. Then they wonder why crime rates are up.
Troubling, indeed, especially when said rates are DOWN.
There's no cure for stupidity but there is for being clueless. Being clueless is becoming more and more dangerous, it's putting us as a society at risk.
Feel free to take the cure anytime.
Common sense needs to return to government, it's been absent for far too long.

You are actually calling for an end to the Harper Government?

If the so called 'progressives' don't like it they can move elsewhere where their left wing agenda is embraced. China, Cuba, Vietnam and Laos all have communist governments, perhaps they can go there.

Considering that the only thing communist left in China or Vietnam is the name of the party, and the fact they're dictatorship, looks like you could actually LIKE it there. I know I wouldn't.

Edited by CANADIEN
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That's not what he said. Logically, it would be a fallacy to argue that anyone who criticizes any aspect of homosexual life is homophobic or gay. But you are (homophobic, that is).

Here is a direct quote of what GH said.

the people I think that sometimes speak the loudest against being gay because they are not even sure about their own sexuality.

GH is saying right here that some of the people who are critical of the gay community may be gay themselves. So stop saying he didn't say that. It's right here in black and white.

You might have a better chance of convincing people to give credence to the little rent above if YOU were not calling for a dictatorship.

I'm not talking about dictatorship or a coup, I'm talking about taking over through democratic means. Kicking all the socialist, hug a thug, save a tree, kiss a jihadist and call him my brother politicians the hell out come election time. This naive line of thinking is going to get us killed.

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