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whats more serious is why wasnt michael sona fired the first time when he got caught trying to steal a ballot box?

Precisely. It's clear that the CPC has encouraged the "by any means necessary" attitude of the "arm's length" subordinates, whom the CPC claim were acting unilaterally. Meanwhile, MPs can't even speak to the media without clearance. Scientists working for the Government of Canada, not to be confused with the Conservative Party :rolleyes: , cannot even give professional opinions without the Harper Government clearing it. Now they want to claim that their campaign workers were free to do whatever they wanted and the party lacked any knowledge whatsoever of their actions? Give me a break. Canadians can't possibly be stupid enough to believe that and the actinos of the Conservative Party undermine this argument.

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That does seem like the prudent course of action; though, who's ever prudent in affairs like this? Even if the Conservative Party released scripts used for pre-vote calls to constituents, none of the opposition would believe they were truly what was used or only what was used, meaning suspicions of Conservative guilt would contine and the Conservatives might appear too desperate to look innocent. That's why it's better for the Conservatives to demand the opposition substantiate their accusations with proof, rather than the Conservatives making a fairly pointless effort to prove their innocence while the opposition sits back and watches; it is innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around.

Why now? Everybody it seems to know this happen during the elction, but how come it took 10 months to come out. And if it is a 3rd party, like in the states, how does that work.
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Where's the scripts, indeed. Unfortunately, it's too late.

Most likely in their CRM called the MEP. Tools such as these are designed to handle campaigns, the text is most likely there.

Edited to add: You think anyone was stupid enough to write something down like that?

Edited by Shakeyhands
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I believe alberta urged mcguinty to support the tar sands more vocally

ergo they started it

Dalton had a chance to show leadership during that speech, but he instead blames the west for his problems, this is NEP all over again. Liberals dividing the country again.
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Why now? Everybody it seems to know this happen during the elction, but how come it took 10 months to come out. And if it is a 3rd party, like in the states, how does that work.

our media sucks.. they did report it during the election then got distracted by something else

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whats more serious is why wasnt michael sona fired the first time when he got caught trying to steal a ballot box?

Once again, you rewrite history to suit your own bias. You make it sound like he was trying to steal a box to rig an election. In actual fact, there was a dispute about the legality of THE BALLOT BOX ITSELF!

Sona was trying to prevent the ballot box from being used. Now, that in itself was wrong. He and the riding association had a right to dispute the validity of the box being used at that location but they had no right to take the law into their own hands.

However, that being said, I would have thought you would approve!

Sona acted precisely and in the same spirit as Anonymous and Occupy, taking the Law into their own hands because of what THEY believed!

I don't expect you to agree, since your postings have consistently shown how biased you are. I just thought I'd point it out for the rest of the posters here on MLW. For the record, I DON"T approve of what Sona had done! Or Anonymous or Occupy either.

In that I at least am consistent!

Edited by Wild Bill
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Sona acted precisely and in the same spirit as Anonymous and Occupy, taking the Law into their own hands because of what THEY believed!

I don't expect you to agree, since your postings have consistently shown how biased you are. I just thought I'd point it out for the rest of the posters here on MLW. For the record, I DON"T approve of what Sona had done! Or Anonymous or Occupy either.

In that I at least am consistent!

Anonymous, Occupy movement (which I find stupid cause you only get change from violence not camping in a tent)

did not try to stop people from voting

Michael Sona did

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Even if the Conservative Party released scripts used for pre-vote calls to constituents, none of the opposition would believe they were truly what was used or only what was used, meaning suspicions of Conservative guilt would contine and the Conservatives might appear too desperate to look innocent.

Precisely.

They said in the House they turned over all material to investigators. We don't know whether the scripts provided to call centre operators were included but they may have. Why provide the opposition ammunition which would only be thrown back in their faces?

it is innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around.

Clearly, the concept has been lost in the feeding frenzy.

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Anonymous, Occupy movement (which I find stupid cause you only get change from violence not camping in a tent)

did not try to stop people from voting

Michael Sona did

I see. Stopping people from voting is wrong. Well, we agree on that!

Blackmailing someone and through him a nation's government is not, because YOU agree with the reason why.

Okay! I understand you now!

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Anonymous, Occupy movement (which I find stupid cause you only get change from violence not camping in a tent)

did not try to stop people from voting

Michael Sona did

"Anonymous" is stupid you say? Well then, why do you relish posting all their youtube videos in addition to supplying a transcript of their contents? :huh:

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If you want to play poker with me, then bring real money, not the old stuff, niether you or I were alive for that and has no meaning to our lives today. At least find something after 1960. ;)

Clearly you're missing the point, whether it was over 100 years ago or a decade ago it can in no way be considered as relevant as something that is currently happening, your "ad scam" red herring is just as ludicrous to bring up as the rail road scandal is. There's plenty to choose from if we look at the last time the PC's were in power back in the 80's. Nice try though, you clearly have nothing intelligent to add to the conversatoin.

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Do you still believe you can predict alternate versions of past history defined by differing variables?

As pointed out that's rather immaterial, what would have happened cannot be known, however what is known is that the election was not allowed to run its natural and unfettered course and thus the results, regardless of the outcome or intentions of those who did not manage to vote for whatever reason, cannot be considered accurate; Even if one single vote was not cast, whether for or against the CPC the results are not accurate.

It is a disservice to democracy to allow such antics, if they did in fact occur, to go without redress. Because we cannot know what the outcome would have been had interference not occurred, I see no other alternative other than to hold a by-election. Because we cannot verify the results we must assume them to be an inaccurate representation of the will of the people and thus we must revisit the affected voters. The only alternative is to consider the result completely accurate and allow them to stand, better to err on the side of caution.

You're right, the will of the voters may very well have changed since the last election, and if the CPC are shown to be linked to this it's a pretty safe bet that it will change if it hasn't already.

Edited by Dave_ON
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I see. Stopping people from voting is wrong. Well, we agree on that!

Blackmailing someone and through him a nation's government is not, because YOU agree with the reason why.

Okay! I understand you now!

We all know and Anonymous knew they weren't going to give in to blackmail

This is a government that muzzles its scientists .. they lost my sympathy

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Anyone with half a brain would question it, most people would know that E.C. doesn't do that, and that polling stations do not close because of voter turnout. I can understand new immigrants maybe not questioning it, but surely one would question it by calling E.C. themselves, the R.O., or a campaign office.

Still, no evidence that the conservative party was behind it either, still speculation and innuendo. As the Liberal leaker has been found, so eventually will these perpetrators. We might be surprised.

We can go on all day about how anyone can fall for any number of schemes that exist in the world. Fact remains they work regardless of whether or not they should. Why do people by things from pop up ads on their computers? Why do they give their Credit Card numbers to strangers over the phone? Why do elderly people have their entire life savings wiped out through various cons? Truth is there's a sucker born every minute, and not everyone is as involved or aware of politics as perhaps the average poster is here.

Indeed nothing is proven at all at this point, but there are many lose ends that are tied to the CPC that make it look suspicious. Why the sudden resignation of the CPC campaign staffer? Was he acting autonomously?

Edited by Dave_ON
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We all know and Anonymous knew they weren't going to give in to blackmail

This is a government that muzzles its scientists .. they lost my sympathy

I get it! It's always ok if it's against someone YOU don't like!

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Okay this is weird

@glen_mcgregor: Postmedia News - Ottawa Citizen has found "Pierre Poutine" of "Separatist St." in Joliette is fake identity used for #robocalls cell phone.

Our scandals are embarrassing.. Pierre Poutine of Separatist street

Edited by olpfan1
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whoever gets caught will probably get charged with more than a fine or 5 years in prison..there is always conspiracy charges you can throw at them amongst others...if anyone is charged I am sure they could be threatened with 20 + years in prison

...with that said..is it legal for the RCMP and Elections Canada to hold a press conference claiming they know who was behind the burner phone and that if they don't come forward within the next 24 hours they will punish them to the full extent of the law? That is if they haven't been able to find much since the investigation began..why not bluff?

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Also, The Conservative campaign in Guelph did not report its expenses with racknine even though its reported they used racknines services ..according to elections canada every campaign must report its expenses

Edited by olpfan1
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