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That's rich, coming from you. No, you googled til you found an example of a Canadian to prove that we are exactly the same as Pakistan, to apologize for Islam, to minimize what Muslim countries

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2018/11/20/female-genital-mutilation-michigan/1991712002/ I had been following this case and am very disappointed in this ruling.  

Islam is the single most barbaric and repressive religion on the planet.  By a very long way.  That is simply the truth.  I've never heard an argument to refute that fact, on here or anywhere else.  T

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Egyptian police are now using dating apps to find gay people so they can imprison and torture them.

And Egypt is one of the less fanatical Muslim countries. In fact, some people here seem to believe they're a wonderful place for people to live.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/egypt-lgbt-gay-facebook-grindr-jail-torture-police-hrw-b742231.html?utm_source=reddit.com

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  • 2 weeks later...

Macron has unveiled a proposal to rid France of Islamic 'separatism', has he seen the light?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8797903/Macron-unveils-proposal-rid-France-Islamic-separatism.html
Macron says Islam 'is in crisis all over the world' as he unveils proposal to rid France of Islamic 'separatism' which has created a 'parallel society' living outside the country's values

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Another beheading. After all, this was the prophet's favorite way of murdering people who disagreed with him, so cutting people's heads off is twice as holy as just murdering them!

A teacher in France dared to show his students the pictures of Muhammed which resulted in the terrorist attack at Charlie Hebdo - though he did warn Muslim students first and suggested they might look away if they'd be offended. That's not good enough, though. Muslims don't want pictures of their noble, holy, child-molesting murderer to be seen by anyone!

The attacker followed Mr Paty, who was heading home on foot after school, inflicted multiple wounds to the head with a knife and then beheaded the victim.

Witnesses are said to have heard the attacker shout "Allahu Akbar", or "God is Greatest".

The man then posted photos of the victim to a Twitter account, along with insults to Mr Macron and French "infidels" and "dogs".

Yes, what a great idea it was to allow millions of such people into the West!

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-54581827

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4 hours ago, Marocc said:

What an incredibly foolish teacher. Maybe the French should learn some common decency?

He was incredibly foolish to think that followers of Islam are peaceful and would not respond to said accusation of "indecency" by committing bloody murder. And to think that other followers of Islam would excuse that.

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7 hours ago, Marocc said:

What an incredibly foolish teacher. Maybe the French should learn some common decency?

What an incredibly inhumane comment.  Maybe you should learn  that its wrong to kill people who think or believe differently than you.  We need fewer Muslims who think like you and that kid, and more like   my brother-in-law and my neighbor, who don't support the death penalty against non-believers.  What an ugly person you are.  

 

SmartSelect_20201019-073045_Google.jpg

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3 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

He was incredibly foolish to think that followers of Islam are peaceful and would not respond to said accusation of "indecency" by committing bloody murder. And to think that other followers of Islam would excuse that.

I know of no school that has such uneducated teachers they would do such a thing. None. Education and sophistication has higher standards here than that. That has nothing to do with the murder. If macron, for instance, didn't keep inciting racism on the French media, France would be better off. They complain of a fire and keep pouring gasoline on it.

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3 minutes ago, Marocc said:

I know of no school that has such uneducated teachers they would do such a thing. None. Education and sophistication has higher standards here than that. That has nothing to do with the murder. If macron, for instance, didn't keep inciting racism on the French media, France would be better off. They complain of a fire and keep pouring gasoline on it.

 

Your cult is really violent.

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8 hours ago, Marocc said:

What an incredibly foolish teacher. Maybe the French should learn some common decency?

Maybe the French should learn to screen their would-be refugees better, especially the Muslims.

Canada should do the same. Any would-be asylum claimant or immigrant should be carefully screened to see what century they're living in. And people with attitudes like yours kept out.

 

Edited by Argus
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It's easy to see why Muslim's wouldn't want too much about Mohammed revealed. Mo himself had a way of dealing with it much like the Jihadi psycho who murdered the French teacher.

Here's a famous one about a poetess from Medina who dared to mention one of the false prophet Mohammed's mulititude of misdeeds:

Quote

perhaps the story from Muhammad’s biography that best lays to rest the silly idea that he never approved of harming women is the assassination of Asma bint Marwan, a poet and mother of five.  For the crime of "displaying disaffection" at the Muslim murder of an elderly man (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 995), the "apostle" ordered her executed in the dead of night.

The brutal murder of this woman by an assassin - who had to remove a suckling infant before plunging the knife into her breast - is recounted here, as is Muhammad’s glee on hearing that his order had been successfully carried out.

Muslims who don’t deny the story outright (as some are prone to do) usually claim that Asma posed a threat to Muhammad, since she urged the Medinan community to put and end to the Muslim reign of terror before it was too late.  Such fervent believers never appear to question why a man claiming to be Allah’s mouthpiece would find it necessary to respond to a woman’s dissention with violence rather than logical argument, particularly if he had done nothing wrong to begin with.

https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/muhammad/women-kill.aspx

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But I'd like to hear from Marocc on that one. Was Asma bint Marwan a "foolish" poet who deserved to die for a lack of common decency.

Oh, and could you offer up this new Islamic definition of what you call "common decency."

Because it sounds like it goes likes this:

Offering a graphic depiction of one of history's most notorious pseudo-religious leaders = Not Commonly Decent.

Murdering anybody who dares to put Mohammed up in public for possible condemnation = Commonly Decent.

 

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Is saturation the answer?  They can't decapitate everyone, can they?

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/charlie-hebdo-cartoons-muhammad-samuel-paty-teacher-france-b1224820.html

Maybe the only way to take a response to being offended from a decapitation level to a strongly worded letter to the editor level is to just keep on offending.

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On 10/21/2020 at 2:26 AM, Infidel Dog said:

But I'd like to hear from Marocc on that one. Was Asma bint Marwan a "foolish" poet who deserved to die for a lack of common decency.

Your story is a fabrication.

https://islamqa.info/en/answers/177694/the-story-of-the-killing-of-asma-bint-marwaan-is-false

"As for the report about the slaying of ‘Asma bint Marwaan that is propagated by these liars, it is a fabricated report. It was narrated by al-Qadaa‘i in Musnad ash-Shihaab (856), al-Khateeb in at-Tareekh (13/99), Ibn ‘Asaakir in his Tareekh (51/244), and Ibn ‘Umar al-Harbi in his Fawaa’id (50), all via Muhammad ibn al-Hajjaaj al-Lakhami Abu Ibraaheem al-Waasiti from Mujaalid ibn Sa‘eed from ash-Sha‘bi from Ibn ‘Abbaas, who said:

(...)

This is an invalid isnaad and a fabricated report that was narrated by Muhammad ibn al-Hajjaaj of whom al-Bukhaari said: His hadeeth is to be rejected. Ibn Ma‘een said: (He is) an evil liar. Ad-Daaraqutni said: (He is) a liar; and on one occasion he said: He is not trustworthy.

Mizaan al-I‘tidaal, 3/509

Ibn ‘Adiyy said: Muhammad ibn al-Hajjaaj fabricated the hadeeth about the woman who used to lampoon the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him), according to which when she was killed he (allegedly) said: “The validity of what you have done is something that no one could dispute.”

End quote from al-Mawdoo‘aat by Ibn al-Jawzi 3/18

This hadeeth was also mentioned by Shaykh al-Albaani (may Allah have mercy on him) in ad-Da‘eefah (6013); he said it is fabricated (mawdoo‘)

(...)

This is a worthless isnaad. Imam Ahmad said concerning al-Waaqidi – whose name was Muhammad ibn ‘Umar ibn Waaqid – : He is a liar; he alters hadeeths. Ibn Ma‘een said: He is not trustworthy. On one occasion he said: His hadeeth is not to be written down. Al-Bukhaari and Abu Haatim said: He is matrook (rejected). Abu Haatim and an-Nasaa’i said: He fabricates hadeeth. Ibn ‘Adiyy said: His hadeeths are odd and problematic. Ibn al-Madeeni said: al-Waaqidi fabricates hadeeth.

Mizaan al-I‘tidaal, 3/663

An-Nasaa’i said: The liars who are known for fabricating hadeeth are four: Ibraaheem ibn Abi Yahya in Madinah, al-Waaqidi in Baghdad, Muqaatil in Khorasan and Muhammad ibn Sa‘eed in Syria.

End quote from Tahdheeb at-Tahdheeb, 9/163"

Edited by Marocc
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It is a disputed Hadith but does it matter when there are so many similar or worse stories in the six major hadith collections and other undisputed collections? 

Even Bukhari tells of  an old man put to death for rejecting the Qu'ran in Mohammed's presence. 

Quote

The Prophet recited Suratan-Najm (103) at Mecca and prostrated while reciting it and those who were with him did the same except an old man who took a handful of small stones or earth and lifted it to his forehead and said, "This is sufficient for me." Later on, I saw him killed as a non-believer.  (Bukhari 19:173)

Ibn Isḥāq who wrote the biography that the Encyclopedia Britannica calls "one of the most important sources on the Prophet’s life" tells the tale of Umm Qirfa an old lady of a tribe that rejected Islam..

Quote

She was a very old woman, wife of Malik. Her daughter [and another] were also taken. Zayd ordered Qays to kill Umm Qirfa and he killed her cruelly by putting a rope between her legs and to two camels and driving them until they rent her in two). (Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 980)

Mohammed had sent his adopted son on the raid and received no rebuke from his adopted dad for pulling the old lady apart with camels or other atrocities committed during or after the raid.

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Oh, and I almost forgot about Ka'b ibn al-Ashraf. He was another poet who said things in his verses Mo didn't like.

Mohammed asked for an assassin to go kill Ka'b and somebody stepped forward saying he'd do it but he'd have to lie. Mo said 'go ahead and lie then."

No less than Sahih Bukhari tells how the assassination was carried out.

https://quranx.com/Hadith/Bukhari/USC-MSA/Volume-5/Book-59/Hadith-369/

Bukhari also told of Abu Rafi, another Poet of the day who had dared to mock Mohammed and Mo had murdered:

https://quranx.com/Hadith/Bukhari/USC-MSA/Volume-4/Book-52/Hadith-264/

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On 10/23/2020 at 7:26 PM, Infidel Dog said:

It is a disputed Hadith

Disputed? No. It is a fabricated and therefore a rejected hadith.

On 10/23/2020 at 7:26 PM, Infidel Dog said:

Even Bukhari tells of  an old man put to death for rejecting the Qu'ran in Mohammed's presence. 

What you quoted says no such thing, obviously.

"As regards the allegation about the story or Umm Qirfa (...)"and the source of the narration is Muhammad ibn ‘Umar Al-Waaqidi, who was accused of lying (...) both of them narrated it from Muhammad ibn Is-haaq who did not mention the chain of narrators of this narration. To conclude, the narration is not authentic so it is not permissible to use it as evidence.” (...) Also, Al-Haafith Ibn Hajar classified this narration, (...)  as Dha’eef [weak], (...) it is known that an interrupted Hadeeth is classified among the categories of Dha’eef [weak] Ahaadeeth.

Al-Haafith Az-Zayla'i also classified it as Dha’eef in his book (...) However, it was said that Sa’eed did not meet Abu Bakr, so this narration is interrupted.

Moreover, Zayd ibn Haarithah is an honorable man who would not do such a thing to that woman, not to mention that mutilating the body of a killed person is forbidden in Islam."

https://www.islamweb.net/en/fatwa/192983/weakness-of-narration-about-the-way-umm-qirfah-was-killed

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Quote

Disputed? No. It is a fabricated and therefore a rejected hadith.

What you quoted says no such thing, obviously.

Well you've jumbled up the two quotes from 2 different sources and tried to make people think they're the same thing.

The first is from Bukhari. I doubt even that guy critiquing the second sample on his site that looks like a teenage girl's MySpace is going to call out Bukhari.

And I don't think you are (at least I hope not). I think you're saying Bukhari is not saying anything that could be critiqued and I don't understand what he is saying.

OK, here's what I think he's saying.

I think he's talking about when Mohammed took over Mecca and he was marching through mecca. 

That's when I think Bukhari says Mohmmed stopper and started delivering what is more commonly called the Surah Najm.

As I recall that one it speaks of how an angel came down from the stars and delivered revelations to Mo.

Bukhari tells us that everybody prostrated on the ground except an old man who grabbed up a handful of dirt, held it to his head and said "This all the revelation I need" or something like that.

Later that old man of Mecca was executed. According to Bukhari.

What do you think I got wrong.

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Now in the second example there's a story from one of Mohammed's biographers. The Encyclopedia Brittanica says this about that:

Quote

Ibn Isḥāq, in full Muḥammad Ibn Isḥāq Ibn Yasār Ibn Khiyār, (born c. 704, Medina, Arabia—died 767, Baghdad), Arab biographer of the Prophet Muḥammad whose book, in a recension by Ibn Hishām, is one of the most important sources on the Prophet’s life.

However, possibly more friendly to your argument they also say this:

Quote

The fact that such biographical narratives about Muhammad are encountered only in texts dating from the 8th or 9th century or even later is bound to raise the problem of how confident one can be in the sīrah literature’s claim to relay accurate historical information. This is not to suggest that there was necessarily an element of deliberate fabrication at work, at least at the level of a compiler like Ibn Isḥāq, who was clearly not inventing stories from scratch. Nonetheless, some accretion of popular legend around a figure as seminal as Muhammad would be entirely expected. At least to historians who are reluctant to admit reports of divine intervention, the problem is reinforced by the miraculous elements of some of the material included in Ibn Isḥāq’s work. Moreover, some of the narratives in question are patently adaptations of biblical motifs designed to present Muhammad as equal or superior to earlier prophetic figures such as Moses and Jesus. For example, before Muhammad’s emigration to Medina he is said to have received an oath of allegiance by twelve inhabitants of the city, an obvious parallel to the Twelve Apostles, and during the digging of a defensive trench around Medina Muhammad is said to have miraculously sated all the workers from a handful of dates, recalling Jesus’ feeding of the multitude. Finally, it is distinctly possible that some reports about events in Muhammad’s life emerged not from historical memory but from exegetical speculation about the historical context of particular verses of the Qurʾān.

 

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More importantly though you somehow forgot the two separate cases of Mo's censorship by death of two different poets as reported by Sahih Bukhari:

https://quranx.com/Hadith/Bukhari/USC-MSA/Volume-4/Book-52/Hadith-264/

https://quranx.com/Hadith/Bukhari/USC-MSA/Volume-5/Book-59/Hadith-369/

As I understand it Bukhari's hadiths are undisputed.

Put all these together and it becomes a pretty solid case. Mo and his followers have been killing critics for centuries.

But if I understand your original claim correctly that's OK because if you criticize or present Mohammed in a way that might be open to criticism you have no, what you call, "common decency."

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iDog, 

You are derailing this thread.  

There is nothing wrong with disputing scripts from days of yore.  It is all perfectly legitimate discussion but the topic of this here thread is space-time-warp limited to current events.  

Please feel free to start a "Last week/month/year/memory hole in Whatever" thread down in the Politics&Religion section down below. 

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Perhaps but if there are accusations of westerners lacking what they call "common decency" for critiquing the aggressive stance of Islam for say offering a illustration of Mohammed there's a historical and ideological context that suggests they look in the mirror.

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