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Who will American voters choose: Clinton or Trump?  

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57 minutes ago, Derek 2.0 said:

 

Sure, and in how many cases does the one allegedly assaulted, that had failed business dealings with the alleged rapist, file a civil action vice criminal charges........in my opinion, the optics look like a money grab.

The Jill Harth complaint against Trump may well have been a cash grab.  What of it? This is a guy who bragged that he can walk up to women and grab their genitals because he's a star and can do whatever he wants. That's not the words of some accuser, that's his own words. What else need be said of him?

Some of you seem to not appreciate the extent to which Donald Trump is now dead. He is finished, toast, wasted, wrecked, ruined, obliterated, devastated, savaged, maimed, mauled, mutilated, disintegrated, erased, eviscerated, eradicated, annihilated, obliterated, doomed, destroyed, and ended. It is OVER.

While the 4chan kids are convinced that Trump is "playing 4d chess on a 3d chessboard against people who only know 2d checkers," it's now clear that Trump was playing 4d chess on a wide open field against people playing full-contact football. This campaign was a reenactment of the Red Wedding, with Trump as Robb Stark and Hillary as Roose Bolton.

The only danger left for Hillary is the unlikely event that the RNC is able to find away to remove Trump from the ticket. If he stays on the ticket... you don't really think this is the last "October Surprise," do you?

 -k

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As a woman, I don't appreciate the things Trump said he did 10 years ago BUT IF u look at what Bill Clinton has done in his past .... which is worse? He was accused of raping women and I was told , he has a son by a Black women, whom Hillary wants no part of.  Many former male employees, are coming forward and telling what the Clintons are and were like  back when Bill was governor and we all know what he was doing in the White House with Monica. Do people forget that there was some information going around about them selling info. to China? I was also told today, that when Clinton was Sec. of State, the President of Libya ask her , to let him leave the country before the attacks and she said no and told the military to kill him. No one  really knows for sure what  kind of President Trump would be  BUT we do know what the Clintons are all about. Trump has to fight off the Clinton and the Bushs  besides  Democrats supporters.  I think Trump is the lesser evil.

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2 hours ago, Derek 2.0 said:

Sure, and in how many cases does the one allegedly assaulted, that had failed business dealings with the alleged rapist, file a civil action vice criminal charges........in my opinion, the optics look like a money grab.

You know Trump himself talked about grabbing women. This isn't some allegation against him. It's the words out of his own mouth. What BC Chick said is exactly right. Your question is like asking if it's really assault if someone punches you in the head and you don't report it. You're trying to say Trump isn't a molester and hasn't assaulted him. He put his hands on them in an uninvited way and bragged about it. He literally bragged that they didn't want it but won't say no. He's boasting about sexual assault, namely groping women.

You're asking if it's really assault. Yes it is. Absolutely undeniably it is. It fits the legal definition and it fits the practical definition. It's you're choice to defend him. Fill your boots. But that's what you're defending when you sit here and try to mitigate what he said.

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I hate Clinton so bad that I will elect a child molester and rapist before I vote for her. Why do I dislike her so? Because the child molester and rapist told me I should because she is married to someone who has consensual sex outside of marriage. 

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1 hour ago, Topaz said:

As a woman, I don't appreciate the things Trump said he did 10 years ago BUT IF u look at what Bill Clinton has done in his past .... which is worse?

First of all, Bill Clinton is not running for president. And secondly, if it ever came out before he was president that he was bragging about grabbing women's "pussies" (Trump's word) because they can't stop him, he likewise would have had his political career destroyed. Bring up Lewinsky and the relationship was consensual. So I have no idea why her name is even brought into any of this. He was an adulterer but she certainly isn't someone he assaulted or molested. Trump is literally bragging about grabbing the genitals of women who have no interest in him.

Edited by cybercoma
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1 hour ago, Topaz said:

As a woman, I don't appreciate the things Trump said he did 10 years ago BUT IF u look at what Bill Clinton has done in his past .... which is worse?

Why do people seem to think Bill Clinton is running for office?

 -k

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4 hours ago, BC_chick said:

 

Why not, rape is about power, not sex.  A wealthy man is actually a perfect candidate for sexual assault because he feels entitled to whatever he wants.  

Inversely, aren't some women attracted to rich/powerful males? Wouldn't it stand to reason that a women spurned by such a man would later say all sorts of terrible things about him?

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3 hours ago, kimmy said:

The Jill Harth complaint against Trump may well have been a cash grab.  What of it? This is a guy who bragged that he can walk up to women and grab their genitals because he's a star and can do whatever he wants. That's not the words of some accuser, that's his own words. What else need be said of him?

Another word for "bragged" is bullshitting.........now this might be a surprise to many, but many men (Not your metro-sexual mangina types) say all sorts of untruths about women among other like minded men in semi-private settings.........doesn't mean such men are Wilt Chamberlain, nor a rapist.

 

Quote

Some of you seem to not appreciate the extent to which Donald Trump is now dead. He is finished, toast, wasted, wrecked, ruined, obliterated, devastated, savaged, maimed, mauled, mutilated, disintegrated, erased, eviscerated, eradicated, annihilated, obliterated, doomed, destroyed, and ended. It is OVER.

And I thought the exact same things when Trump made numerous faux-pas during the primaries, including going after George W Bush, Mitt Romney and John McCain.....yet here we are.........on paper I'd tend to agree with you, yet I wouldn't feel comfortable betting against Trump either...

 

 

Quote

 

The only danger left for Hillary is the unlikely event that the RNC is able to find away to remove Trump from the ticket. If he stays on the ticket... you don't really think this is the last "October Surprise," do you?

 -k

 

 

 

Not at all.......for either Trump or Clinton.

 

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2 hours ago, cybercoma said:

You're asking if it's really assault. Yes it is. Absolutely undeniably it is. It fits the legal definition and it fits the practical definition. 

Legally speaking, who are all these women that Trump "raped"?

 

If a Bullshitter bullshits in the woods, without a hot mic, does anybody hear it?

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2 hours ago, kimmy said:

Why do people seem to think Bill Clinton is running for office?

 

Because he set the standard for how to "respect" women so well.   Obviously Bill Clinton would have some influence on his president wife, whom he has respected so much in the past.

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11 minutes ago, Derek 2.0 said:

Another word for "bragged" is bullshitting.........now this might be a surprise to many, but many men (Not your metro-sexual mangina types) say all sorts of untruths about women among other like minded men in semi-private settings.........doesn't mean such men are Wilt Chamberlain, nor a rapist.

 

Men may lie about their conquests but it takes a special kind of sleazeball to lie about sexually assaulting women (by grabbing their pussy) if untrue.

Anyone defending this type of 'locker room' banter also needs to thoroughly reevaluate themselves.  You can do like Mike Pence and say it's offensive but I forgive him, but it's a whole other level of oblivion to shrug it off a men being men.

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12 minutes ago, BC_chick said:

Men may lie about their conquests but it takes a special kind of sleazeball to lie about sexually assaulting women (by grabbing their pussy) if untrue.

 

I see it as one in the same.............Trump's actions (and inactions) towards women have been a given for decades...... 

 

Quote

Anyone defending this type of 'locker room' banter also needs to thoroughly reevaluate themselves.  You can do like Mike Pence and say it's offensive but I forgive him, but it's a whole other level of oblivion to shrug it off a men being men.

 

I see it as the opposite, this is common, normal, behavior among most men........though I agree with Pence on many issues, I'm not observant of his puritan religious values.....the key difference that I would observe between many like minded (real) males is most observe that there is a time and a place.... this alone is what separates a chauvinist from a gentleman........

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huh

3 hours ago, Derek 2.0 said:

Another word for "bragged" is bullshitting.........now this might be a surprise to many, but many men (Not your metro-sexual mangina types) say all sorts of untruths about women among other like minded men in semi-private settings.........doesn't mean such men are Wilt Chamberlain, nor a rapist.

 

Trump can of course go to the American people and say that he never actually non-consensually groped anybody, and that he was just saying that stuff because he wanted to impress Billy Bush.  Maybe he still will. I wonder why he hasn't done that already?  Maybe because he knows that there's a lot more shoes just waiting to drop.

I mean, I recall seeing an interview with Ivanka from earlier this year where she insisted that her dad's not a groper.  The rumors were already out there. If he comes out and says "oh, that's not true, I never actually did that, it was all just BS I made up to impress some guy", would it even work, or would it just make him look like an even bigger liar, and a scared one at that? If he did that, how many women are going to come out of the woodwork with stories? Erin Burnett related a story a friend told her yesterday... maybe that was BS, maybe it wasn't. How many more Trump Tic-Tac encounters are we going to hear about if he says he never actually groped women? (you can add Tic-Tac USA to the list of those who have publicly renounced Donald Trump, btw.)

Also, I doubt that Trump would actually go to the American people and say "it wasn't true, it's all just BS I made up to sound like I'm a big shot."   I don't think he's actually psychologically capable of doing that. I think he's too emotionally invested in this image that people have of him to come out and publicly admit that he's a phony.  He desperately wants and needs people to think he's a big shot who can just walk up to women and do whatever he wants. It's why he says stuff like this in the first place. It's why he was bragging about the size of his schlong in the primaries debate, the reason he gets furious when people mock the size of his hands, the reason he gets furious when people question the real size of his business enterprise, the reason he can't talk about himself or his businesses without using all those superlatives. The biggest, the best, tremendous, everybody loves me. He wants people to see him that way, he needs it. He needs people to believe that he's a Greek god type figure that women are just so in awe of that he can just start groping or kissing them and they're powerless to resist.  It would kill him inside to go to the American people and tell them that's not actually who he is, that it's just a fake persona he made up. I don't think he can actually do it.

Maybe I'm wrong, though. Maybe he can pull off some astounding act of public contrition that makes everybody take sympathy on him. Maybe he will go on TV and shed tears of remorse, say "I never actually did that, I just made it up because deep inside I am just a scared little boy..." and people will feel sad for him. Do you think Trump could bring himself to be "SAD! And Pathetic!" on TV to make people feel sorry for him instead of disgusted at him?

3 hours ago, Derek 2.0 said:

And I thought the exact same things when Trump made numerous faux-pas during the primaries, including going after George W Bush, Mitt Romney and John McCain.....yet here we are.........on paper I'd tend to agree with you, yet I wouldn't feel comfortable betting against Trump either...

This one feels different. This might not make any difference to "the deplorables", but he can't win the general election with just "the deplorables". I've been hearing anecdotes of suburban moms ripping the Trump signs off their lawns and throwing them in the garbage.  The number of Republicans who've publicly bailed on him is unprecedented. The extent to which he's been rejected by female Republican senators and congresswomen should be especially worrying to Trump supporters.  Reports are that the RNC put a stop work order on their Trump mail-outs. I think the mass exodus from the Trumpwagon over the past 24 hours indicates that they believe he's finished and are fleeing the sinking ship.  And I suspect that a great many of them are genuinely disgusted with the man, as well.

 -k

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14 hours ago, kimmy said:

This is a guy who bragged that he can walk up to women and grab their genitals because he's a star and can do whatever he wants. That's not the words of some accuser, that's his own words. What else need be said of him?

 

The only thing wrong was that he used crude words.  Here's what he'd said:


“You know I’m automatically attracted to beautiful — I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait,” said Trump of the women he meets.

And when you’re a star they let you do it,” he said. “You can do anything. Grab them by the p*ssy. You can do anything.”


Ex-‘Apprentice’ producer says there are ‘far worse’ Trump tapes to come
 

 

"And when you’re a star they let you do it," that's the key phrase.   We're in a celebrity-struck society!  How many women throw themselves at celebrities?   He was talking as a celluloid celebrity....it was braggadocio!  Why would he be talking like that if not for publicity?

How many men talk crudely about women in locker rooms?  Some women talk crudely about men among themselves, like "he's led by his c***?"

 

 

What I find amusing is the amount of hypocrisy, and double standard being levied against Trump.  Bill Clinton and Hillary did far worse, according to Kathleen Willey, Paula Jones, and other women who'd come forward to accuse Bill of sexual harrassment, assault and rape....and Hillary, of being her husband's enabler.

Furthermore, Trump had already apologised for that which happened in 2005.

 

Will this finish him?  I don't know.  It might, but then again it might not.  This is a very suspenseful election.  Who knows what's going to come up next?

 

Edited by betsy
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6 hours ago, kimmy said:

huh

Trump can of course go to the American people and say that he never actually non-consensually groped anybody, and that he was just saying that stuff because he wanted to impress Billy Bush.  Maybe he still will. I wonder why he hasn't done that already?  Maybe because he knows that there's a lot more shoes just waiting to drop.

I mean, I recall seeing an interview with Ivanka from earlier this year where she insisted that her dad's not a groper.  The rumors were already out there. If he comes out and says "oh, that's not true, I never actually did that, it was all just BS I made up to impress some guy", would it even work, or would it just make him look like an even bigger liar, and a scared one at that? If he did that, how many women are going to come out of the woodwork with stories? Erin Burnett related a story a friend told her yesterday... maybe that was BS, maybe it wasn't. How many more Trump Tic-Tac encounters are we going to hear about if he says he never actually groped women? (you can add Tic-Tac USA to the list of those who have publicly renounced Donald Trump, btw.)

 

 

Trump did admit that he failed in seducing the married woman he talked about in that video.  I didn't hear anything about him forcing himself on her after she shut him down.  He did disparage her new breasts....sounds more like a sour grape talk to me (which means he was stung by the rebuff). 

How do you define "grope?"  In this day and age, a man can't even put his arm around a woman's shoulders without being labelled a "groper."  Depends on the incident, the context, the way things happened.  You can't say he groped her without knowing the details.

 

But what we do know, are the details from women who accused Bill Clinton (not for making any crude jokes or remarks about them).....but for actually committing crimes against them.

 

 

‘Enabler’ Hillary Clinton haunted by efforts to ‘destroy’ husband’s accusers


Running to be the first woman president, Democratic presidential hopeful Hillary Clinton has taken a stern stand on combating sexual harassment and assault — and has insisted that every accuser who comes forward has “the right to be believed.”

But Mrs. Clinton took a very different approach herself 25 years ago as the wife of then-Gov. Bill Clinton, leading the effort to discredit women who came forward with their own stories of harassment or assault by her husband.

Campaign narratives written by reporters detailed how she honchoed the campaign team that handled “bimbo eruptions,” digging up personal papers and official records that could be used to undercut the stories told by a series of women. One top aide later recounted Mrs. Clinton’s intent to “destroy” the story of one accuser, while former adviser Dick Morris said Mrs. Clinton engaged in “blackmail” to try to force women to recant their stories.


“Was dreading seeing my abuser on TV campaign trail for enabler wife but his physical appearance reflects ghosts of past are catching up,” Juanita Broaddrick, who in 1999 accused Mr. Clinton of having raped her decades earlier, tweeted last week.

A day later she wrote: “I was 35 years old when Bill Clinton, Ark. Attorney General raped me and Hillary tried to silence me. I am now 73 it never goes away.”

And Paula Jones, who sued Mr. Clinton for sexual harassment, winning an $850,000 out-of-court settlement to drop the case, said earlier this month that Mrs. Clinton enabled her husband in his abuse.

“Well, she stood by her man, all right. And she allowed her husband to abuse women, to harass women, possibly other things that he did wrong to women. And she allowed it to happen. As a matter of fact, she would go out and she would try to discredit these women, including me,” Ms. Jones told Breitbart Radio.


Neither Ms. Broaddrick, who accused the former president of rape, or Kathleen Willey, who accused Mr. Clinton of sexual assault, have had their stories disproved. And Ms. Jones’ husband said they considered the settlement the Clintons paid an “apology” to her.


More.....


Hillary Clinton haunted by efforts to 'destroy' Bill Clinton accusers - Washington Times

 

 

 

Kathleen WIlley, now 69, made a splash in 1998 by claiming in a '60 Minutes' interview that Bill Clinton had sexually assaulted her during a Oval Office meeting in 1993.

Now she says Mrs. Clinton, the former secretary of state, has a history of trying to silence the multiple women her husband has slept with, sexually assaulted or sexually harassed since his 1980s Arkansas days.

Willey's story, largely consistent since its first telling, is that the president fondled her breast and placed her hand on his clothed, erect penis in the Oval Office while she was asking him for a White House job.

Together with her husband Ed, Willey had been among the Clintons' earliest and most ardent campaigners in Virginia, and the president had singled her out at multiple campaign events for giant bear hugs that seemed to last longer than expected.

She was already a volunteer in the White House social office during the Clinton administration's first year, but needed a salary after her husband was investigated for embezzling from one of his legal clients.

He later committed suicide, although WIlley wrote in a 2007 book that she suspects the Clintons were involved in his death – which occurred on the same day she saw the president in the Oval Office.




Read more: Bill Clinton sex-assault accuser Kathleen Willey says Hillary 'enabled it to happen' | Daily Mail Online

 

 

 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, betsy said:

The only thing wrong was that he used crude words.  Here's what he'd said:

Good to know the standards Christians adhere too.  Now personally, if I heard my son talk like that about women, I'd be disgusted and I'd tell him so.   I'd not be making excuses for him.

 

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6 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Good to know the standards Christians adhere too.  Now personally, if I heard my son talk like that about women, I'd be disgusted and I'd tell him so.   I'd not be making excuses for him.

 

Then be honest, stop editing my statements, and stop taking them out of context. 

You shouldn't teach your son that kind of low-blow deception.

 

You liberals, it seems, never could tell right from wrong..........and so confused with all these holier-than-thou act!

Read again.  Understand what you read!

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22 hours ago, BubberMiley said:

I've been in lots of locker rooms but I don't recall anyone bragging about sexually assaulting people. You must run in different circles than I do.

As I said, it is all about getting Trump on something to try and get the people to change their minds on voting for Trump and instead vote for Hillary. I just hope that the Trump supporters stick to the plan, and make sure that Hillary does not become President. If she did become President then hubby Bill may have access to many more females to get his jollies with. And Hillary no doubt will allow it to happen. It will be business as usual in the White House. But hey.

      

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6 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Oh sure...now Trump has really gone too far.    All that other "hateful" stuff was just a minor distraction !

The 'other stuff' was just crude and nasty.

Now Trump is admitting to committing crimes.

I think it is a matter of time before woman start appearing and the indictments begin. 

Debate question: Mr Trump are you aware that it is a crime to grab someone in the genitals without their consent? 
Any bets on the response making Trump look good?

Edited by TimG
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49 minutes ago, betsy said:

The only thing wrong was that he used crude words.  Here's what he'd said:


“You know I’m automatically attracted to beautiful — I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait,” said Trump of the women he meets.

And when you’re a star they let you do it,” he said. “You can do anything. Grab them by the p*ssy. You can do anything.”


Ex-‘Apprentice’ producer says there are ‘far worse’ Trump tapes to come
 

 

"And when you’re a star they let you do it," that's the key phrase.   We're in a celebrity-struck society!  How many women throw themselves at celebrities?   He was talking as a celluloid celebrity....it was braggadocio!  Why would he be talking like that if not for publicity?

How many men talk crudely about women in locker rooms?  Some women talk crudely about men among themselves, like "he's led by his c***?"

 

 

What I find amusing is the amount of hypocrisy, and double standard being levied against Trump.  Bill Clinton and Hillary did far worse, according to Kathleen Willey, Paula Jones, and other women who'd come forward to accuse Bill of sexual harrassment, assault and rape....and Hillary, of being her husband's enabler.

Furthermore, Trump had already apologised for that which happened in 2005.

 

Will this finish him?  I don't know.  It might, but then again it might not.  This is a very suspenseful election.  Who knows what's going to come up next?

 

This is just astoundingly ignorant. You don't need to repost his words. Everyone's seen them. His own wife denounced what he said. Let that sink in for a minute in light of you saying there was nothing wrong with them.

Let me ask you, Betsy, since there's nothing wrong with what he said. Are you okay with a complete stranger that you've just met grabbing your crotch? Trump obviously  likes them young, so how about some old man she's never met before grabbing your daughter's or a niece's crotch?

There's NOTHING wrong with that? Do words even have meaning to you?

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Bill Clinton has been pushing the idea of Hillary being President, ever since  they left and I do believe that Bill will have some say in what Hillary does as President. He knows the ins and outs and I don't think Americans should trust them and don't be surprised if the USA get into a war with Russia under the Clintons. 

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I disliked Trump from the moment I first heard him speak. It was during the eighties when he was setting up his short lived airline. I don't even remember what he said but I knew I wouldn't want to work for that guy. I wasn't alone among my compatriots and he has done nothing but confirm that feeling ever since. This might be considered normal behaviour for drunken frat boys trying to impress their friends about their non existent experience but my guess and experience is that most grown up men don't talk about a "hot" woman, much differently than most grown up women would talk about a man they considered to be"hot". Trump was not a drunken frat boy when he made those statements, he was sober and pushing 60. Now he is 70 and still hasn't changed.

The Howard Stern interviews are very enlightening. Stern is a master at baiting the hook and Trump falls all over himself trying to grab it, even when it comes to talking about his daughter. Any self respecting parent would say, Howard, you are talking about my daughter and I don't like it. Now people will say it is hypocritical to demand a certain level of respect for the women in your family while showing none for women who aren't and it is hypocritical but jeez, you would think they guy would have some standards. But it wasn't about Ivanka, it was Trump boasting about himself and what he had a part in making.

Trump says he likes women and he does, but he likes them for what they can do for him in bed and in business, not for who and what they are.

The man is an asshole.

Edited by Wilber
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