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Ontario's Sunshine List is Out again

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2 hours ago, Ash74 said:

You just described the Ontario Liberals. Except they will hire more civil workers for the votes

I was a member of the Conservative party back in the days when Hudak was around, the conservative party of ontario is the liberal party but worse, which is why I left it.

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19 hours ago, hernanday said:

I was a member of the Conservative party back in the days when Hudak was around, the conservative party of ontario is the liberal party but worse, which is why I left it.

I don't believe anything is worse than Wynne. I was proud Ontario voted a lesbian woman because it showed the world we are above the prejudices but she proved there was something worse than Bob Rae or Dalton Mcguinty.

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1 hour ago, Ash74 said:

I don't believe anything is worse than Wynne. I was proud Ontario voted a lesbian woman because it showed the world we are above the prejudices but she proved there was something worse than Bob Rae or Dalton Mcguinty.

Yes but she is still marginally better than Harris.  And this is why liberals keep getting re-elected.  The conservative party of ontario is all of the bad from liberals but on steroids, more corrupt, more theft, more incompetent, more corporate hotel buyoutism.  The conservative party of ontario's policies are literally written by the lobbyist who donate to the party, I recall being in meetings fighting with these lobbyist, and it was those of us who believed in conservatism, fighting the lobbyist, and the lobbyist won.

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15 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

People aren't that concerned about a few hundred doctors earning millions. They're more concerned that all across the province, most of the richest people in almost every town, village and even city, are public servants. I was at the grocery store today. As often happens, there were firemen there doing their daily grocery shopping. Their truck was parked outside. Two days a week of work for a hundred thousand a year, and most of that time spent showering, shaving, eating, drinking, watching TV, cooking, cleaning the trucks, etc.

A job should be paid whatever is needed to obtain quality employees. We don't need to pay cops, firefighters or teachers, much less bus drivers, nearly a hundred thousand a year. And with overtime, many earn much more. It's ridiculous and it not only costs the taxpayers it also costs people in services we don't get because they cost too much. Paying so many teachers so much money means bigger classes, and lesser educations. Paying so many cops and firefighters so much means longer response times. Paying bus drivers so much means routes cut back to save money.

The point of the sunshine list is an attempt to shame governments about how much they're paying people. Of course, governments have no shame.

Edited by Argus

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10 hours ago, Argus said:

People aren't that concerned about a few hundred doctors earning millions. They're more concerned that all across the province, most of the richest people in almost every town, village and even city, are public servants. I was at the grocery store today. 

 

We can pursue different angles on this. My point is that the Ontario Sunshine List is simply a false account of who the high earners are. 

Edited by SpankyMcFarland

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On 5/31/2017 at 6:42 PM, Bob Macadoo said:

Didn't you know.....only one man deserves his pay in this province.....and he sure as hell ain't no immigrant.

Anyone in the private sector gets what pay he or she can command for their skillset and competes against all others on price and performance. The problem with the public sector is that determination is divorced from reality.

You don't need to pay cops, firefighters, teachers or bus drivers $100k to get plenty of capable candidates. University professors are wildly overpaid too, given how little work they do.

 

Edited by Argus

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Lack of hiring, relying on OT, gets you non-professional civil servants making $100k.  There's a simple solution to that dilemma if you don't like it.  Let's check the calculator on this; 1 guy for $100k or 2 guys for $65k; 100 < 130......not to mention double the benefits that would need to be paid.  Seems right.

20 minutes ago, Argus said:

Anyone in the private sector gets what pay he or she can command for their skillset and competes against all others on price and performance. The problem with the public sector is that determination is divorced from reality.

You don't need to pay cops, firefighters, teachers or bus drivers $100k to get plenty of capable candidates. University professors are wildly overpaid too, given how little work they do.

 

 

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Just now, Bob Macadoo said:

Lack of hiring, relying on OT, gets you non-professional civil servants making $100k.  There's a simple solution to that dilemma if you don't like it.  Let's check the calculator on this; 1 guy for $100k or 2 guys for $65k; 100 < 130......not to mention double the benefits that would need to be paid.  Seems right.

Drivel. Cops and firefighters already have a BASE salary of $90,000, excluding very generous benefits. Median teachers salaries are now in the mid to high eighties. There are literally thousands and thousands of teachers, cops and firefighters making over 100k in Ontario, and it's not because of lack of hiring but because of collective agreements and a cozy relationship between the Ontario Liberals and the public sector unions.

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Ottawa just signed a contract with its police union which will give them a BASE salary of $100k in two years. Since the way the system works in Ontario whatever cops get in one area all cops get in all areas that means every single cop will be on the sunshine list in two years. I'm willing to bet we would have no difficulty finding tons of people willing and able to do the job, which requires a high school diploma, for $50k. 

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/four-year-police-contract-would-see-100k-constable-in-2019

Edited by Argus

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Well this won't change what the high earners on a real Sunshine List take in but it may alter what they end up with:

http://www.montrealgazette.com/business/energy-resources/federal+government+moves+loophole+used/13769060/story.html

Incorporation is sold to physicians with exactly these features highlighted. Paying your relatives as officers or employees of the company (which I didn't know as 'sprinkling' before) and deferring tax for decades are two benefits that have been widely touted in this country. 

So full credit to the Liberals on this, esp. Mr. Morneau who presented his proposals very well. Notice how quiet the Tories are on this file as they can see the downside of getting trapped into defending tax avoidance schemes. However, the monetary benefit to the lower orders is mainly in the morale column as 200-500 million bucks don't go far split millions of ways. The offshore crowd need to be hunted now. 

 

Edited by SpankyMcFarland

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On 2017-06-02 at 0:02 PM, Argus said:

Ottawa just signed a contract with its police union which will give them a BASE salary of $100k in two years. Since the way the system works in Ontario whatever cops get in one area all cops get in all areas that means every single cop will be on the sunshine list in two years. I'm willing to bet we would have no difficulty finding tons of people willing and able to do the job, which requires a high school diploma, for $50k. 

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/four-year-police-contract-would-see-100k-constable-in-2019

The absolute number is open to debate but cops are well paid compared to other workers in most developed countries for good reason. Number of training years is one criterion for pay and degree of stress/difficulty another. A high school diploma also entitles you to sit the ATC exam, do the training and earn a very good income in a challenging job. 

https://takecharge.navcanada.ca/selection-requirements-and-process/application-process/

 

Edited by SpankyMcFarland

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On 7/19/2017 at 5:54 PM, SpankyMcFarland said:

The absolute number is open to debate but cops are well paid compared to other workers in most developed countries for good reason. Number of training years is one criterion for pay and degree of stress/difficulty another.

The training takes weeks, and the job can be done by almost anyone in reasonably good physical condition. I'm still waiting for the good reason why our cops and firefighters should be paid more than the ones in the UK or France or the US.

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