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Canadian ISIS Sympathizer killed by police

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Did I hear right? According to Ralph Goodale, Minister of Public Safety, "Outreach" efforts will be stepped up by our government. Looks like more resources will be assigned to de-radicalize or halt radicalization of radicalized individuals. I feel warm, fuzzy and safer already.

Hunh ...

"de-radicalize or halt radicalization" of people under surveillance would be an improvement over creating crimes and entrapping hapless people - Nuttall and Karody - or no effort to halt radicalization, and then shooting him.

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That's not actually true. They've found "outs" in their interpretation of the texts that give them the religious justification to murder civilians just because they don't practice Islam the way ISIS/extremists interpret it. I think "radical Islam" is a good description, more accurate than "Islamic fundamentalists".

That's not an "out", that is Islam. If you're not a radical, you're an infidel.

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Here we go, Goodale's exact comments re the need for "outreach".

Because why try to stop these things before they start? Amirite?

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How is it the FBI managed to spot the video he made? How is it every single thing this guy did on the internet wasn't being watched by CSIS or CSEC?

To your first question, the FBI (and more so NSA) attempt to monitor all foreign terror threats..........to your later question, CSIS and CSEC can't just lawfully "watch" Canadians (sans warrants, intelligence indicating a foreign threat from a foreign source etc etc) , anymore then the American intelligence agencies can do to Americans..........

In this case, absent a warrant, outside of Driver communicating with terror groups in Dirka-Dirkastain, there is very little Canadian policing and intelligence agencies can do..........

As ISIS is exterminated in Iraq and Syria, it will only become stronger in the metaphysical sense for the West to combat as its further decentralized into a dogma only found in the minds of the deranged and disenfranchised in solitary cells globally........this is the start of the new normal.

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What is interesting in this case, and hasn't been mentioned in the media or by the Federal Government, and is all but alluded to by the RCMP's legalize filled public statement, is the impact of C-51, namely the portions of the law further granting Canadian policing agencies the ability to act on information, sans a warrant, obtained by a foreign government............if Driver wasn't killed, but detained/arrested and later charged, this could have been the first major challenge of C-51 in a courtroom..........outside the expected challenge of Nuttell and Korody and their "terrorism Peace Bonds" (a new addition to the legal toolbox granted by C-51), an expected challenge based on the previously successful challenge of a "terror Peace Bond" by one Aaron Driver..............remember when Trudeau promised to "fix" C-51 during the election???????? RCMP hollow points just fixed it for him....... :lol:...... :ph34r:

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I'm not. I'm arguing against what I guess I see as the suggestion, because I've seen it elsewhere so often, that the Islam as practiced and believed by ISIS is only believed by a few isolated extremists. It's not. The Wahabbi version of Islam has been steadily spreading and gaining ground around the world as the result of hundreds of billions of dollars the Saudis have put into proselytizing.

Yes.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabism

Many Sunni and Shia Muslims disagree with the Wahhabi movement, and a widely circulated conspiracy theory holds it to have been a product of British secret service efforts for causing the demise of the Ottoman empire.[34] Ulema, including Al-Azhar scholars, regularly denounce Wahhabism in terms such as "Satanic faith".[34] Wahhabism has been accused of being "a source of global terrorism",[35][36] inspiring the ideology of the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL),[37] and for causing disunity in Muslim communities by labelling Muslims who disagreed with the Wahhabi definition of monotheism as apostates[38] (takfir) and justifying their killing.[39][40][41] It has also been criticized for the destruction of historic mazaars, mausoleums, and other Muslim and non-Muslim buildings and artifacts.

Wahabis kill more moderate Muslims than they do westerners. Archaic, brutal, violently expansive, used and funded by Saudi and western nations too to destabilize countries and depose leaders to gain access to their resources.

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Edited by jacee

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See, white guy! It's not a racial thing.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/terror-threat-arrest-rcmp-1.3715969

So I guess instead of incarcerating people who've shown a tendency to support Islamic terrorism, you can just issue a peace-bond and ban them from participating in online activity to be further radicalized. And it allows them to be closely monitored.

This appears to be a success story for Anti-terrorism efforts.

I wonder who radicalized that guy.

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We aren't at war..

Well, I gotta agree with Squid here. Apparently, according to our PM and Dion, we are not at war with ISIS.

Canada not at war with ISIS: Trudeau

THE CANADIAN PRESS

http://www.torontosun.com/2016/03/23/canada-not-at-war-with-isis-trudeau

It's pathetic though, how Trudeau defines war through semantics.

Edited by betsy

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I read some on-line blogs (and probably watched some youtube videos as well), and the Muslims were 'winning' the argument against the Christians and Atheists so I though I would blow something up.

That essentially is how Aaron Terrorist was 'radicalized'.

It's pathetic though, how Trudeau defines war through semantics.

What is pathetic is how megalomaniacs use the term 'war' in order to convince the masses that their cause is just. This is no different than the radical Islamic terrorists using the term 'jihad' to support their cause. Donald Trump will be the greatest mass murderer of all time if he is allowed to hold office.

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That's not an "out", that is Islam. If you're not a radical, you're an infidel.

Your extremist, ISIS-inspired views are fortunately not shared by the billion Muslims on earth who are, unlike you, moderates who don't feel the call to a clash of civilizations.

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How did he became radicalized? Good question.....u know the CIA have been doing mind control since the 1970s. Goggle mind control and the CIA. I am not saying this IS going on but what better way to get Canada more into the war on ISIS than to create attacks here. Also, I am sure there are people who listen to the news and hear over and over again about NATO attacks in the ME and the women and children being killed, become very angry and strike out. I am not taking either side, I hate killings and violence but all this mess falls on the US and Britain when GW was President.

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Because why try to stop these things before they start? Amirite?

Because if you stop the,M before they start, Conservatives have a harder time fear mongering.

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To your first question, the FBI (and more so NSA) attempt to monitor all foreign terror threats..........to your later question, CSIS and CSEC can't just lawfully "watch" Canadians (sans warrants, intelligence indicating a foreign threat from a foreign source etc etc) , anymore then the American intelligence agencies can do to Americans..........

It's quite amazing how many opinionated individuals here don't know or don't care that the intelligence community is only allowed to monitor foreign threats, sharing information with their domestic partners in other countries. The apparatus worked exactly as it should have here,

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Your extremist, ISIS-inspired views are fortunately not shared by the billion Muslims on earth who are, unlike you, moderates who don't feel the call to a clash of civilizations.

It's tough to explain that to people who have no Muslim friends and probably never even met a Muslim person in their life.

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Hunh ...

"de-radicalize or halt radicalization" of people under surveillance would be an improvement over creating crimes and entrapping hapless people - Nuttall and Karody - or no effort to halt radicalization, and then shooting him.

.

By the time they come under surveillance by security agencies it's usually too late to turn things around. My preference would be to concentrate outreach efforts as close to community resources as possible, and to bolster such resources. Aaron Driver, alias Harun Abdurahman, was past the point of no return.

Driver, who grew up Christian, had a troubled childhood and was not close with his father or stepmother. He turned to Islam when he was 17 after watching videos online.

For many people who have become radicalized, Hamdani said, there is a lack of understanding about Islam.

"[They] had a very rudimentary knowledge of Islam. They were not scholars, they are not well versed, they were people who had a very simple understanding," he said.

One of the things that can curb radicalization, Hamdani said, is for people to learn the Muslim religion. She said that's why it was dismaying to learn Driver's requirement to attend religious counselling was removed from his anti-terrorism peace bond in February by a Winnipeg judge.

"The closer they get to being members of a mosque and a larger religious community, the less likely they will have extreme or radical ideas that will lead to violence," he said.

....

London Muslim Mosque released a statement Thursday indicating that Driver had come to its attention about a year ago. Members tried to "change his perspective" and kept the police informed of his presence, according to the statement.

Radicalization is highly individualized and the deradicalization process needs to reflect that, Shaikh said. Although counselling must be involved, judges need to start looking at conspiracy charges rather than peace bonds when a person shows they are rejecting the community's efforts, he added.

"Now in these sorts of cases, maybe [the Crown] might start going back to conspiracy [charges]," he said adding he would like to see the justice system err on the side of public safety over civil liberties in terrorism cases.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/how-to-counter-radical-extremism-1.3717914

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To your first question, the FBI (and more so NSA) attempt to monitor all foreign terror threats..........to your later question, CSIS and CSEC can't just lawfully "watch" Canadians (sans warrants, intelligence indicating a foreign threat from a foreign source etc etc) , anymore then the American intelligence agencies can do to Americans..........

I find it very difficult to believe they couldn't get warrants based on the known threat, and if they tried and were refused I'd like to hear it, and the law would need to be changed in that case.

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Your extremist, ISIS-inspired views are fortunately not shared by the billion Muslims on earth who are, unlike you, moderates who don't feel the call to a clash of civilizations.

Really? None of them?

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How did he became radicalized? Good question.....u know the CIA have been doing mind control since the 1970s.

Oh boy... :rolleyes:

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I read some on-line blogs (and probably watched some youtube videos as well), and the Muslims were 'winning' the argument against the Christians and Atheists so I though I would blow something up.

That essentially is how Aaron Terrorist was 'radicalized'.

What is pathetic is how megalomaniacs use the term 'war' in order to convince the masses that their cause is just. This is no different than the radical Islamic terrorists using the term 'jihad' to support their cause. Donald Trump will be the greatest mass murderer of all time if he is allowed to hold office.

The definition of war is simple, according to merriam.

  • a state or period of fighting between countries or groups

  • : a situation in which people or groups compete with or fight against each other

  • : an organized effort by a government or other large organization to stop or defeat something that is viewed as dangerous or bad

According to Trudeau:

A war is something that can be won by one side or the other and there is no path for ISIL to actually win against the West," Trudeau said. "They want to destabilize, they want to strike fear. They need to be stamped out."

That's a cockamamie line!

If Isil wants to destabilize and strike fear - they've won, right?

Destabilize

:to cause (something, such as a government) to be unable to continue existing or working in the usual or desired way

: to make (something) unstable

Why do we now have so many security measures? Just to go through the airport alone....it now takes hours, and so many extra manpower to conduct vetting. At what cost? That shows we're already destabilized.

Therefore.....

If we base it on Trudeau's own definition of war :rolleyes: ........ISIS has already won!

If there's nothing to fear, it should be business as usual, without any changes!

If there's nothing to be concerned about, then Trudeau should be the first to set the example, and open up Parliament Hill just like it was before Isil! Show us all there's nothing to fear.

We're at war with ISIS, dear PM Trudeau....whether you like it or not.

Edited by betsy

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Why do we now have so many security measures?

To sell the wares of the corporate masters that paid to get our leaders elected. Those security measures have been 100% failure other than to pad the pocket of big business cronies.

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To sell the wares of the corporate masters that paid to get our leaders elected. Those security measures have been 100% failure other than to pad the pocket of big business cronies.

:rolleyes:

I suppose we all simply imagined all those foiled terrorist attacks on Canadian soil. And all those Canadians who went joining ISIS abroad.

Are you saying our Intelligence is lying to us about security issues? There was no "Toronto 18?"

That's all made up? These are all lies made by our Intelligence?

A recent history of alleged terror plots foiled in Canada

http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/a-recent-history-of-alleged-terror-plots-foiled-in-canada-1.1350923

Edited by betsy

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Your extremist, ISIS-inspired views are fortunately not shared by the billion Muslims on earth who are, unlike you, moderates who don't feel the call to a clash of civilizations.

It's not my views, it's their views. They wrote them down, easy to read for yourself.

Would you take it at face value if someone told you they were a moderate Nazi?

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A recent history of alleged terror plots foiled in Canada

Thank you for the list that proves that the security measures in the airports have been 100% ineffective.

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Thank you for the list that proves that the security measures in the airports have been 100% ineffective.

Whether they're effective or ineffective is, irrelevant.

We have security measures....because of what we saw with 9/11....and all the other terrorist attacks that happened

all over the world. We have security measures because of the threats to our security.

Edited by betsy

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