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Wilber

The Banana Republic is at it again

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17 minutes ago, Wilber said:

Outgoing Michigan and Wisconsin lame duck legislatures vote to hamstring incoming governors and attorney generals.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/12/4/18123784/gop-legislature-wisconsin-michigan-power-grab-lame-duck

American democracy in action.

What's your fascination with America?  Do you pay attention to any other countries?

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6 minutes ago, Truth Detector said:

What's your fascination with America?  Do you pay attention to any other countries?

Shady, after years of whining about Obama's booming economy, you're really going to whine about people paying attention to the U.S. now that your clown president is presiding over the nation's demise? That's hilarious.

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24 minutes ago, Truth Detector said:

But there's no such thing as voter fraud.  Democrats and the media have told us so!

It's electoral fraud, not voter fraud that is being investigated. The board has four democrats and four republicans, the vote not to certify was 6 to 2.

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28 minutes ago, Truth Detector said:

What's your fascination with America?  Do you pay attention to any other countries?

This is the United States Politics Forum is it not? There are 215 pages of topics on this particular forum, I have started maybe two or three in over ten years. 

Edited by Wilber

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3 minutes ago, Wilber said:

This is the United States Politics Forum is it not? There are 215 pages of topics on this particular forum, I have started maybe two or three in over ten years. 

They're embarrassed they supported a lying clown whose campaign team, national security advisor, and personal council are all convicted felons, so they attack you for even bringing up the topic of the U.S. now. It would be funnier if it weren't so pathetic.

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22 minutes ago, JamesHackerMP said:

And another topic turns into a troll-fest.

It amazes me that outgoing governments can get away with this shit. In Canada, if you lose an election you start cleaning out your desk the next day, you aren't entitled to legislate anything.

Edited by Wilber

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It's due to the fact that the president cannot "dissolve" Congress before the election (or a governor cannot dissolve the state legislature). The legislative branch does not go out of existence just because there's an election. If it did, it would give too much power to the presidency (or governorship of a state). The flaw of course is that it leaves a "lame duck" legislature/Congress in power. Some states have done things to their constitution to prevent this, some haven't.

At the federal level, the President can only call the lame duck Congress back into session if there's an important matter to attend to. (But he cannot actually tell them what to do once they're sitting). As for the states, I guess it varies from one state to another. Nonetheless, he could possibly abuse the privilege.

Edited by JamesHackerMP
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2 minutes ago, JamesHackerMP said:

It's due to the fact that the president cannot "dissolve" Congress before the election (or a governor cannot dissolve the state legislature). The legislative branch does not go out of existence just because there's an election. If it did, it would give too much power to the presidency (or governorship of a state). The flaw of course is that it leaves a "lame duck" legislature/Congress in power. Some states have done things to their constitution to prevent this, some haven't.

Legislatures aren't constantly in session, they do take breaks. I can see outgoing legislatures as watchdogs until the new group is in place, but to pass legislation that restricts the powers of the newly elected is one of the most undemocratic things I have ever heard of in a supposed democracy.

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7 minutes ago, Wilber said:

It amazes me that outgoing governments can get away with this shit. In Canada, if you lose an election you start cleaning out your desk the next day, you aren't entitled to legislate anything.

 

Sure...but in Canada...the PM can prorogue Parliament...and has done so for political purposes.  

 

 

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1 minute ago, Wilber said:

Legislatures aren't constantly in session, they do take breaks. I can see outgoing legislatures as watchdogs until the new group is in place, but to pass legislation that restricts the powers of the newly elected is one of the most undemocratic things I have ever heard of in a supposed democracy.

I have to agree with you there. But that doesn't sound like something that can happen (to my limited knowledge) under my state's constitution. And there's nothing in the federal constitution that would allow Congress to do to an incoming president what MI and WI did to their incoming executives. It's obviously a flaw in those state constitutions that needs to be repaired. Every constitution has stuff in it that they didn't think about, flaws that need to be fixed, and so forth. Before calling the United States a "banana republic" I'd look around a little more, first.

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1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Sure...but in Canada...the PM can prorogue Parliament...and has done so for political purposes.  

 

 

So what.

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1 minute ago, Wilber said:

So what.

Americans would find that a constitutional flaw. But it's one you have to live with in a parliamentary democracy, just as a lame duck Congress/legislature is a flaw you have to live with in a presidential one.

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1 minute ago, JamesHackerMP said:

I have to agree with you there. But that doesn't sound like something that can happen (to my limited knowledge) under my state's constitution. And there's nothing in the federal constitution that would allow Congress to do to an incoming president what MI and WI did to their incoming executives. It's obviously a flaw in those state constitutions that needs to be repaired. Every constitution has stuff in it that they didn't think about, flaws that need to be fixed, and so forth. Before calling the United States a "banana republic" I'd look around a little more, first.

OK, how about some states act like Banana Republics.

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We're not a banana republic. We have federal/state constitutions with some flaws in them. Name one country that doesn't. And if you say Canada, I'll reach for the bottle of maple syrup. :P

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Just now, JamesHackerMP said:

Americans would find that a constitutional flaw. But it's one you have to live with in a parliamentary democracy, just as a lame duck Congress/legislature is a flaw you have to live with in a presidential one.

A PM may be able to prorogue Parliament but that just prevents legislation from being passed.

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1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Exactly...Canada's government and election system is so perfect. 

No it isn't perfect but it doesn't allow people who have lost their mandate to make or pass legislation. That at least is democracy.

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Just now, Wilber said:

No it isn't perfect but it doesn't allow people who have lost their mandate to make or pass legislation. That at least is democracy.

A flaw in a constitution doesn't make a country a banana republic, Wilber. Seriously, you're being a little jingoistic.

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1 minute ago, JamesHackerMP said:

It also keeps an executive branch in power WITHOUT the legislative (parliament) to restrain it.

But it can't change the law without parliament

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Just now, JamesHackerMP said:

A flaw in a constitution doesn't make a country a banana republic, Wilber. Seriously, you're being a little jingoistic.

If that flaw allows it to be governed like a banana republic?

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