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The Slow Painful Death of the Trump Administration


Iznogoud

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3 minutes ago, Iznogoud said:

Russia and Syria?  So conceding the Middle east to the Russia and Iran is your solution? 

 

How many troops does Canada have in Syria (see "Operation Impact").   How many strike aircraft remain in theatre ?

So the answer, at least for Canada/Trudeau is a resounding yes for Syria.

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1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

How many troops does Canada have in Syria (see "Operation Impact").   How many strike aircraft remain in theatre ?

So the answer, at least for Canada/Trudeau is a resounding yes for Syria.

The thread is about Trump.  Feel free to start one about Canada's foreign policy if you wish.

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Just now, Iznogoud said:

The thread is about Trump.  Feel free to start one about Canada's foreign policy if you wish.

 

And Trump is about leaving Syria, just like Canada did a long time ago (e.g. CF-18s).  

Why is there a different expectation for Trump and the United States ?

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Democrat on the Armed Services Committee defends President Trump's decision on Syria....at least he is consistent:

Quote

President Trump is receiving an onslaught of criticism for his decision to withdraw troops from Syria and Afghanistan. Congressional Democrats should not pile on without offering an alternative vision. We should applaud the president’s desire to put an end to these interventions, but should challenge him to assemble a team that does so with better planning and diplomacy. We should articulate a foreign policy doctrine of responsible withdrawal that prioritizes restraint and human rights.

Let’s start with a fact that the mainstream media has glossed over when criticizing Trump’s Syria decision: His decision is in compliance with U.S. and international law. The presence of U.S. troops in the Syrian civil war was never authorized by Congress. We are also violating international law by invading Syria without the approval of the United Nations. Before any administration official can advocate keeping troops in Syria to fight the Islamic State, Congress needs to offer authorization.

Trump also deserves credit for standing up to the war hawks within his own administration who started inventing rationales for remaining in the country: countering Iran and seeing an end to the Assad regime. That is the definition of mission creep.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2018/12/22/trump-was-right-pull-out-syria-afghanistan-this-is-what-he-should-do-next/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.bf8cdb02770f

 

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It is still off-topic.  However, Canada consulted with its allies before leaving and gave due warning.  This is not what Trump did.  Also I hardly think 6 aircraft would make much of a difference considering the number of aircraft supplied by other NATO nations.  BTW Canada still has troops in Iraq.  As usual Canada always seems to get involved in conflicts that do not involve it directly. 

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1 minute ago, Iznogoud said:

It is still off-topic.  However, Canada consulted with its allies before leaving and gave due warning.  This is not what Trump did.  Also I hardly think 6 aircraft would make much of a difference considering the number of aircraft supplied by other NATO nations.  BTW Canada still has troops in Iraq.  As usual Canada always seems to get involved in conflicts that do not involve it directly. 

 

This is the same kind of lame rationale that earns Canada its "NATO deadbeat" reputation.    Iraq is not Syria.

 

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1 hour ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

This is the same kind of lame rationale that earns Canada its "NATO deadbeat" reputation.    Iraq is not Syria.

 

I could care less.  You are still off-topic.  Start a "I hate Canada's foreign policy" thread if you like and we'll talk about it there. 

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6 minutes ago, Iznogoud said:

I could care less.  You are still off-topic.  Start a "I hate Canada's foreign policy" thread if you like and we'll talk about it there. 

 

Sorry...you lose.   Mods here determined that contrasts and comparisons were on topic, especially since it is done so often in other "Canadian" threads vis-a-vis U.S. public/private individuals and policies.   

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10 hours ago, Iznogoud said:

Russia and Syria?  So conceding the Middle east to the Russia and Iran is your solution?  That will certainly go down well with the GOP.  This is just going to be another nail in the Trump coffin. 

I don't see anything in your numbers that contradict mine.  The wall is an expensive boondoggle.  Fortunately it will never be built.  BTW, the number of illegals attempting to cross the border has declined considerably in the last decade so there is actually less need of a wall or even border agents than before.  Most of the concern over border crossing has been generated due to the hot air coming from Trump, and not any increase in actual border crossings. 

Conceding Syria, not the entire Middle East. 

The US is hated there. It doesn’t help that their own MSM tries to make Trump look like a bad guy every time he makes a move there. Even when he directly attacks Assad for gassing people they do their best to make America look bad.

The easiest job in the world right now is to work in the Al Jazeera propaganda department. All they have to do is live stream CNN.

 

How do you think our numbers are the same? You factored in one expense. That’s like someone starting a restaurant and forgetting about the cost of napkins, glassware, electricity, cleaning supplies, waste, decorating, advertising, pilferage, etc. You can’t do up a budget and only account for the cost of food and wages. 

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Some people here like to think that pulling out of Syria is a huge mistake for Trump, and that’s just more mindless CNNery.

CNN would take offence if he committed to ousting Assad, even though it was Obama’s goal as well - “He’s crazy! He’ll start a war with Russia!”

CNN would take offence if he committed to staying in Syria for another year - “Trump’s war-mongering is too expensive!”

Etc, etc.

The only way to make sense of the decision to leave Syria is to consider what’s left to accomplish there, what it would cost, and what will happen there if the US pulls out. Then you also need to think about whether or not the US has bigger fish to fry elsewhere, and what might happen down the road which the US will need huge gobs of money for.

Forget everything that you heard on CNN, they have no desire to do any accurate reporting on the topic. By now you should know that they need to come up with the most scathing rebuke of Trump’s actions no matter what he does, on every topic under the sun. They couldn’t give Trump a win right now even if there was a sudden peace agreement between Israel and Palestine and Islamic terrorism/extremism ceased to exist. They’d give the credit to Obama, the UN, “the religion of peace”, NATO, Bitcoin, Colin Kaepernick, or even their almighty Satan before Trump. If you don’t know that by now you’re dumber than a sack of Democrats.

Is Islamic State defeated in Syria? Can Russia and Syria finish the clean-up? How much money does the US save by pulling out now? Can they really justify another year of bloody turmoil in Syria just to kill Assad? Did killing other dictators ever accomplish a whole lot? Does the US population have the resolve to stay there, spend the money and see all the killing? Can Trump claim victory over Islamic State and just get out now? Does his government need the money?

Those are the questions that need to be answered. Focusing on CNN talking points is like trying to run your car using everything but gasoline. 

 

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20 hours ago, Kerfuffle said:

Is there anything good that Trump has done?

 

a wall in your future.jpg

Plenty. It is just that the lying leftist liberal media will not report on anything good that Trump has done. All the media is concerned about is to constantly try to blame Trump on everything that goes on and give Trump no credit at all. It's all Trump's fault. If Trump gave a thousand dollars to every American citizen today the media would find fault in it some how. Trump will never win with the lying actors and activists in the liberal media like CNN.

That picture you posted? Isn't that Hillary's head that I see in there trying to climb the wall? :lol:

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On 12/20/2018 at 5:03 PM, Iznogoud said:

How do you know I'm telling the truth?  Well, you could try checking the numerous mainstream media sites instead of relying on FOX and other Trump apologists.  You could also consider the fact that over 30 of Trump's associates have been indicted on criminal charges and that Trump himself has been named in several of those indictments.  You could also stop misidentifying the people you call "swampsters."  Take a look at the people Trump surrounded him with when he first took office.  Many of them were exactly the sort of people he vowed to get rid of and many of them are still parts of his administration. 

Trump in fact has done considerable damage to the United States.  I don't think he has done much damage to Canada, but it is not for want of trying with his unnecessary tariffs.  However, during his short two years this is what he has achieved:

He has cozied up to the US' most dangerous enemy - namely Russia while at the same time alienating the nations he needs as US allies.

He started an unnecessary trade war with China and the EU.

He has harmed the average US citizen by encouraging organizations that are harmful to the US like the NRA and attempted to weaken social program like healthcare. 

He has implemented a disastrous tax policy which has the US National Debt growing at an unsupportable rate. 

Trump's only saving grace is the fact that he is so incompetent that he has failed to get done much of what he promised.  He has squandered his first two years and now that the Democrats are going to take over the House his chances of getting anything else done are about zero. 

 

I think it might be useful to for you stop being a fan of Trump and look at what he has actually done.  He is not a sporting team to be supported no matter how badly he performs.  He is the president of the United States and should judged on his performance, which is pretty bad so far. 

 

FOX News works well for me. The rest lie like thieves when they get caught in their lies and many do. They constantly like to spread horse manure about Trump. All they do is end up looking stupid which is quite normal looking for them to look anyway. The problem with Mueller is that he cannot get Trump on anything and so he goes after the people who surrounded Trump and finds guilt somewhere on them. If the mule were to go after democrats for a change there would be many of them found guilty of a crime and would probably end up going to jail. But that is not what the mule is there for. The swampsters put Mueller in there to try and get Trump period. It was Trump who called people like Mueller and Hillary and Comey as swampsters and not me. I am just repeating what he said. Washington is full of swampster liars and crooks and Trump haters. They all want Trump out because Trump is doing something good for America and Americans and the lefties do not like that because it makes them look bad and rightly so. what the hell did Obama and Hillary ever do that was good for America and Americans. I can find plenty of bad things that they have done. Hillary should be in prison by now. 

Russia-Russia-Russia. Russia is not the most dangerous enemy to America and no threat to America at all. China is a danger and a threat though. It is the swampsters in America also like Hillary and Obama that wanted to try and get a cold war going with Putin and Russia. You listen to the leftist liberal lying media a little too much. Try listening to FOX News once in awhile. They do not lie like the media that you enjoy watching enjoy doing all the time. Trump is not trying to alienate any country. What Trump has done is now woke up the people of those many allied nations to the corruption that goes on in many of those US ally countries and has exposed their crimes against their people and they hate Trump now for doing so. 

China has been not playing fair ball with America on trade at all and Trump has decided that they are not going to allow China to rip off America anymore. Trump only wants ts to play fair ball with China when it comes to trade. I see no problem here at all with Trump and how he is dealing with China on trade. Only Trump haters do. 

Where or how has Trump harmed any Americans? Please point this out to me? Like what? What Trump has done is woke up the American people to do swampster corruption that has been going on in Washington for decades now. The swampsters are on the run and fighting for their useless and crooked lives. The NRA is a great organization and the only people who despise the NRA are people who hate guns. What has the NRA done to you or any American that has made you feel that the NRA has been harmful to America and Americans? Please explain. 

You need to concern yourself more about what your dear leader prime mistake of Canada has been doing since he became king of Canada and on how he has gone about blowing our Canadian tax dollars by the billions on so many useless and stupid liberal/socialist/communist programs and agendas that have done not a thing that is great for Canada and Canadians, unless you can show me something, rather than keep yourself all up tight over Trump and is tax plan for America. Have you bothered to check lately how much tax dollars has been wasted and how Trudeau keeps putting the taxpayer's in this country deeper in debt? Get off Trump's back and starting climbing all over Trudeau's back for a change. Your hatred and obsession with Trump is deplorable. 

Trump cannot get anything done when everybody around him tries their hardest to try and make sure that he does not succeed. His enemies are everywhere because Trump wants to drain the swamp. Even people in his own party is full of enemy swampsters like Paul Ryan. If Trump had majority house and senate that you would see that Trump would get a lot done as he promised to the people who voted for him. It is for sure that nothing will get done now because the swampsters have taken over the house reins again. When your party is pretty much now in the minority like is done here with a minority government that governing party cannot get much done either. That is how politics works. 

When you can show me something more substantial then what you have shown me here that Trump has been all that bad for America well maybe then I will listen too you and what you have to say. But until then, you have not offered me anything here to change my mind about Trump. All I get from you is the hatred that you have for Trump and nothing more. It is time for you to start to attack Trudeau more often rather than Trump for a change. Trudeau is your dictator leader. Trump is not your president. 

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18 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

And Trump is about leaving Syria, just like Canada did a long time ago (e.g. CF-18s).  

Why is there a different expectation for Trump and the United States ?

The USA would have spent about 10,000 times more money fighting Syria than Canada did. It’s not even comparable. 

Lefties loved it when Trudeau pulled out, but they hate Trump for doing it 3 years later. Go figger.

All Demsters abide by the hypocritical oath. 

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On 12/20/2018 at 6:25 PM, taxme said:

There were no crimes committed by Trump at all otherwise Trump would have been charged and arrested and tried and convicted for committing some crime by now. The swampsters are getting scared and desperate and they have declared war on Trump a war that they will lose. Trump is draining and cleaning the swamp slowly but surely of his swampster enemies. :D

Need to drain the swamp  starting with corrupt GOP

321147622_yearsinpower.jpg.eaa365b66cef7f008bde999ea99665ac.jpg

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2 minutes ago, Kerfuffle said:

Need to drain the swamp  starting with corrupt GOP

321147622_yearsinpower.jpg.eaa365b66cef7f008bde999ea99665ac.jpg

Let's see: LBJ, Carter - 1 term each; Obama, Clinton - 2 terms each - that makes 24 years.  How do they get 25 ?  Also Nixon, Ford, Bush I - 1 term each, Reagan, Bush 2 - 2 terms each and Trump - 2 years makes 30.

This is a bad math meme...

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2 hours ago, taxme said:

FOX News works well for me. The rest lie like thieves when they get caught in their lies and many do. They constantly like to spread horse manure about Trump. All they do is end up looking stupid which is quite normal looking for them to look anyway. The problem with Mueller is that he cannot get Trump on anything and so he goes after the people who surrounded Trump and finds guilt somewhere on them. If the mule were to go after democrats for a change there would be many of them found guilty of a crime and would probably end up going to jail. But that is not what the mule is there for. The swampsters put Mueller in there to try and get Trump period. It was Trump who called people like Mueller and Hillary and Comey as swampsters and not me. I am just repeating what he said. Washington is full of swampster liars and crooks and Trump haters. They all want Trump out because Trump is doing something good for America and Americans and the lefties do not like that because it makes them look bad and rightly so. what the hell did Obama and Hillary ever do that was good for America and Americans. I can find plenty of bad things that they have done. Hillary should be in prison by now. 

Russia-Russia-Russia. Russia is not the most dangerous enemy to America and no threat to America at all. China is a danger and a threat though. It is the swampsters in America also like Hillary and Obama that wanted to try and get a cold war going with Putin and Russia. You listen to the leftist liberal lying media a little too much. Try listening to FOX News once in awhile. They do not lie like the media that you enjoy watching enjoy doing all the time. Trump is not trying to alienate any country. What Trump has done is now woke up the people of those many allied nations to the corruption that goes on in many of those US ally countries and has exposed their crimes against their people and they hate Trump now for doing so. 

China has been not playing fair ball with America on trade at all and Trump has decided that they are not going to allow China to rip off America anymore. Trump only wants ts to play fair ball with China when it comes to trade. I see no problem here at all with Trump and how he is dealing with China on trade. Only Trump haters do. 

Where or how has Trump harmed any Americans? Please point this out to me? Like what? What Trump has done is woke up the American people to do swampster corruption that has been going on in Washington for decades now. The swampsters are on the run and fighting for their useless and crooked lives. The NRA is a great organization and the only people who despise the NRA are people who hate guns. What has the NRA done to you or any American that has made you feel that the NRA has been harmful to America and Americans? Please explain. 

You need to concern yourself more about what your dear leader prime mistake of Canada has been doing since he became king of Canada and on how he has gone about blowing our Canadian tax dollars by the billions on so many useless and stupid liberal/socialist/communist programs and agendas that have done not a thing that is great for Canada and Canadians, unless you can show me something, rather than keep yourself all up tight over Trump and is tax plan for America. Have you bothered to check lately how much tax dollars has been wasted and how Trudeau keeps putting the taxpayer's in this country deeper in debt? Get off Trump's back and starting climbing all over Trudeau's back for a change. Your hatred and obsession with Trump is deplorable. 

Trump cannot get anything done when everybody around him tries their hardest to try and make sure that he does not succeed. His enemies are everywhere because Trump wants to drain the swamp. Even people in his own party is full of enemy swampsters like Paul Ryan. If Trump had majority house and senate that you would see that Trump would get a lot done as he promised to the people who voted for him. It is for sure that nothing will get done now because the swampsters have taken over the house reins again. When your party is pretty much now in the minority like is done here with a minority government that governing party cannot get much done either. That is how politics works. 

When you can show me something more substantial then what you have shown me here that Trump has been all that bad for America well maybe then I will listen too you and what you have to say. But until then, you have not offered me anything here to change my mind about Trump. All I get from you is the hatred that you have for Trump and nothing more. It is time for you to start to attack Trudeau more often rather than Trump for a change. Trudeau is your dictator leader. Trump is not your president. 

Here's some advice.  Do not repeat anything that Trump says as evidence of anything.  Almost 7000 lies so far and counting.

How has Trump hurt Americans?  Count the ways.

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/09/trump-trumka-afl-cio-labor-day-15-ways-hurt-american-worker-populism.html

Russia is not a threat?  FOX News thinks it is.  http://tass.com/world/1022243

The fact that China is also a threat does not detract from Russian meddling in US domestic and international affairs.

I guess you missed the two years when Trump's party controlled both the House and the Senate.  What did he get done?  Remarkably little

Your Canada comment is not relevant.  This is a thread about Trump.

BTW Trump is not worth my hate - in fact I hate very few politicians.  I do feel sorry for the voters Trump has betrayed with his false promises and general incompetence. 

 

 

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8 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

How do you think our numbers are the same? You factored in one expense. That’s like someone starting a restaurant and forgetting about the cost of napkins, glassware, electricity, cleaning supplies, waste, decorating, advertising, pilferage, etc. You can’t do up a budget and only account for the cost of food and wages. 

Our numbers are not the same.  Mine give hiring more workers a fudge factor of several billion.  Yours ignore both the actual cost of the wall and the disruptions it will cause on the US side as well as its maintenance costs. 

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17 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Sorry...you lose.   Mods here determined that contrasts and comparisons were on topic, especially since it is done so often in other "Canadian" threads vis-a-vis U.S. public/private individuals and policies.   

Go ahead and think that if you wish.  I'm not discussing Trudeau in a thread about Trump. 

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6 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

It's not just that....the math is even more half-assed for actual indictments and convictions.

Thank you for playing anyway.

Remember you only have 10 fingers and 10 toes so any counting above 20 and your phukt...but have at her...

“I made a comment recently where I claimed that Republican
administrations had been much more criminally corrupt over the last 50
plus years than the Democrats. I was challenged (dared actually) to
prove it. So I did a bit of research and when I say a bit I mean it
didn’t take long and there is no comparison.

When comparing criminal indictments of those serving in the executive
branch of presidential administrations, it’s so lopsided as to be
ridiculous. Yet all I ever hear about is how supposedly “corrupt” the
Democrats are. So why don’t we break it down by president and the
numbers?

Obama (D) – 8 yrs in office. Zero criminal indictments, zero
convictions and zero prison sentences. So the next time somebody
describes the Obama administration as “scandal free” they aren’t
speaking wishfully, they’re simply telling the truth.

Bush, George W. (R) – 8 yrs in office. 16 criminal indictments. 16
convictions. 9 prison sentences.

Clinton (D) – 8 yrs in office. 2 criminal indictments. One conviction.
One prison sentence. That’s right nearly 8 yrs of investigations. Tens
of millions spent and 30 yrs of claiming them the most corrupt ever
and there was exactly one person convicted of a crime.

Bush, George H. W. (R) – 4 yrs in office. One indictment. One
conviction. One prison sentence.

Reagan (R) – 8 yrs in office. 26 criminal indictments. 16 convictions.
8 prison sentences.

Carter (D) – 4 yrs in office. One indictment. Zero convictions and
zero prison sentences.

Ford (R) – 4 yrs in office. One indictment and one conviction. One
prison sentence.

Nixon (R) – 6 yrs in office. 76 criminal indictments. 55 convictions.
15 prison sentences.

Johnson (D) – 5 yrs in office. Zero indictments. Zero convictions.
Zero prison sentences.

So, let’s see where that leaves us. In the last 53 years, Democrats
have been in the Oval Office for 25 of those years, while Republicans
held it for 28. In their 25 yrs in office Democrats had a total of
three executive branch officials indicted with one conviction and one
prison sentence. That’s one whole executive branch official convicted
of a crime in two and a half decades of Democrat leadership.

In the 28 yrs that Republicans have held office over the last 53 yrs
they have had a total of (a drum roll would be more than appropriate),
120 criminal indictments of executive branch officials. 89 criminal
convictions and 34 prison sentences handed down. That’s more prison
sentences than years in office since 1968 for Republicans. If you want
to count articles of impeachment as indictments (they aren’t really
but we can count them as an action), both sides get one more. However,
Clinton wasn’t found guilty while Nixon resigned and was pardoned by
Ford (and a pardon carries with it a legal admission of guilt on the
part of the pardoned). So those only serve to make Republicans look
even worse.

With everything going on with Trump and his people right now, it’s a
safe bet Republicans are gonna be padding their numbers a bit real
soon.

Edited by Kerfuffle
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