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Did Trudeau Fail His Country On Covid-19

Did Trudeau Fail His Country On Covid-19  

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7 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

You are.

Fact is that Trump ran circles around sock-boy in the fight against covid, but people like you act like Trudeau did fine for us Canadians and that Trump failed 'Murica.

This is silly. From what I have read so far of Argus, I'd say you are incorrect.

But the real kicker is that both Trump and Trudeau failed while we continue to argue with each other over who is worse.  That's sad. Also the wrong focus.

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7 hours ago, New World Disorder said:

But the real kicker is that both Trump and Trudeau failed while we continue to argue with each other over who is worse.  That's sad. 

Agreed that they both failed. Countries like Japan and Taiwan who blocked travel from Hubeii Province right away and issued masks to their citizens kicked ass.

Apparently doing the opposite of what the WHO says is the way to go. Duly noted.

The reason that this is an issue is that the MSM in the States and in CANADA want to tell us that "TRUMP SCREWED IT UP ROYALLY!!!!!!!" and Trudeau was just his dreamy self all along. The truth is - Trudeau did worse, his actions were 100% wrong. Trump banned travel 45 days before sock boy and both countries started social distancing at the same time. Trudeau was still telling Canadians not to wear masks for a long time. There's no room for debate about which leader took the exact wrong path. The media tells you different though. They also vouch for the WHO. That's weird.

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7 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

Agreed that they both failed. Countries like Japan and Taiwan who blocked travel from Hubeii Province right away and issued masks to their citizens kicked ass.

Apparently doing the opposite of what the WHO says is the way to go. Duly noted.

The reason that this is an issue is that the MSM in the States and in CANADA want to tell us that "TRUMP SCREWED IT UP ROYALLY!!!!!!!" and Trudeau was just his dreamy self all along. The truth is - Trudeau did worse, his actions were 100% wrong. Trump banned travel 45 days before sock boy and both countries started social distancing at the same time. Trudeau was still telling Canadians not to wear masks for a long time. There's no room for debate about which leader took the exact wrong path. The media tells you different though. They also vouch for the WHO. That's weird.

They either have no idea what they are doing, or there really was no crisis to begin with. I am having a hard time determining which is which.

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1 hour ago, New World Disorder said:

They either have no idea what they are doing, or there really was no crisis to begin with. I am having a hard time determining which is which.

Agreed.

The only redeeming quality that the leaders who failed us in the fight against covid "might" have, is if they received near unanimous agreement from their medical experts that a stronger version of covid would come back around in the fall, and they wanted their population to have some herd immunity to it.

I admit that's a pretty lame and unlikely story, and if it's true it is essentially gambling with human lives, but anything is better than "we're so stupid that we didn't think closing the border was a good idea, and we thought that masks really were bad" lol.  

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23 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

Agreed.

The only redeeming quality that the leaders who failed us in the fight against covid "might" have, is if they received near unanimous agreement from their medical experts that a stronger version of covid would come back around in the fall, and they wanted their population to have some herd immunity to it.

I admit that's a pretty lame and unlikely story, and if it's true it is essentially gambling with human lives, but anything is better than "we're so stupid that we didn't think closing the border was a good idea, and we thought that masks really were bad" lol.  

Wonder what is so hard about them telling us the truth. What are they afraid of?

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1 hour ago, New World Disorder said:

Wonder what is so hard about them telling us the truth. What are they afraid of?

I don’t think they’re afraid of anything, I just think they want more control over everything. Control the media, control the narrative, control people.

Trudeau literally owns our media lock, stock and barrel. Rebel media isn’t allowed to put a camera or a mic anywhere near that guy. CTV, CBC and Global are just his lackeys.

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Over 7,300 Canadians are dead now. Tens of thousands of businesses will probably be permanently closed by the time we're open again: https://business.financialpost.com/news/economy/wave-of-business-closures-to-hit-canada-despite-government-help

"Blocking travel from covid hotspots is racist! Don't wear masks!"

Trudeau is just a worthless idiot on his best days. 

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1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Over 7,300 Canadians are dead now. Tens of thousands of businesses will probably be permanently closed by the time we're open again: https://business.financialpost.com/news/economy/wave-of-business-closures-to-hit-canada-despite-government-help

"Blocking travel from covid hotspots is racist! Don't wear masks!"

Trudeau is just a worthless idiot on his best days. 

There has to be 1 or 2 things that Trudeau did that you liked since he became PM ?!. Lets hear it. Focus on the positive. How can 1 single man be responsible for everything wrong that appears ? Next I am going to hear that he created the coronavirus.

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Even Maclean's magazine , pretty much as liberal as you can get, is not happy with how our country has handled this pandemic. So how could one man be responsible for everything that goes wrong in the nation, Well he is the PM, the man in charge, our nations leader, The guy that does make the final decision when it comes to our nation....and in this time of crises  I would hope he is making those decisions...decisions that have been so wishy washy is it sometimes comical, like it would not make ANY difference if we closed down our borders, face masks would not make any difference in transmission, well we are about to enter mask are no longer a option for airports, etc, etc...in fact they now recommend face masks....the list goes on and on...And it is not that we did not have a tried and trusted plan to follow , all we had to do was follow other nations that were successful in flattening the curve...

Anyways it makes for a great read.....The liberals are going to continue to make excuses, for Teflon boy...but now even liberals are asking questions...

Quote

Simply put, Canada is bungling its most significant peacetime crisis in a century.  That is why I am writing this sequel not just as a health scientist, but also as a constitutional lawyer—because the seeds of our failure are everywhere.

 

Quote

Let’s start with the big question: is Canada really “bending the curve”?  the answer is, “not much”. Many Canadians think we have because we are doing better than the United States—a country having no public health care, vocal COVID-19 deniers, and a president who recommends injecting bleach.  The Americans are obviously not the right comparators.  Better to compare Canada with other wealthy countries, especially confederations having federal-provincial complications like our own.


 

Quote

 

On this measure, Canada lags behind not just top performers like Australia and South Korea, but even Cuba, Ethiopia, Kenya and Rwanda (the epidemic will likely hit them later). Africans outclass Canada on sheer effort too: Addis Ababa’s feat of screening millions door-to-doors puts Montreal and Toronto to shame.

For Canada to be beaten by the world’s poorest continent is a humiliation. Can it be that Canada lacks the scientists, laboratories or wealth to do better? Certainly not. The fault instead lies in the cupidity and stupidity of our governments—for while the agent of the pandemic is a virus, the cause of Canada’s failure lies in its political choices

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/how-canada-has-bungled-the-covid-19-endgame/ar-BB14QLjz?ocid=spartanntp

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19 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

...all we had to do was follow other nations that were successful in flattening the curve...

We've had some provinces and smaller regions setting good examples too.  BC was looking like it had the potential to turn into a real hot spot but all in all I'd say we're pretty bloody happy with how things are turning out. Zero cases on Vancouver Island for at least a couple weeks now. I attribute a lot to the sheer willingness of British Columbians to pay attention to experts as well as to developments unfolding in other parts of the world to inform their actions.  A lot of success here and elsewhere is also just as attributable to NOT following the examples some places were setting.

I don't recall a lot of British Columbians sitting around waiting for Ottawa or Trudeau to give us directions before figuring out what worked best for us on our own. In that sense the best thing Ottawa did was stay out of the way.

Edited by eyeball
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1 hour ago, eyeball said:

Not.

Your utter failure to make sense of what was going on was duly noted a few pages ago eyeball. We get it. We expected it. This ain't our first roedayoe.

When Japan said that they weren't allowing travellers from Hubeii province do you think they banned their citizens from returning home? That's a pretty easy way to guarantee an election loss. When Canada banned travel do you think we told our citizens to stay the f out? No, we did not. 

The entire rest of the world understands this. You're literally the only person making this bizarre claim.

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1 hour ago, Independent1986 said:

There has to be 1 or 2 things that Trudeau did that you liked since he became PM ?!. Lets hear it. Focus on the positive. How can 1 single man be responsible for everything wrong that appears ? Next I am going to hear that he created the coronavirus.

Maybe he stubbed his toe or stepped on a rake a few times, but I didn't see it.

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1 hour ago, Army Guy said:

Even Maclean's magazine , pretty much as liberal as you can get, is not happy with how our country has handled this pandemic. So how could one man be responsible for everything that goes wrong in the nation, Well he is the PM, the man in charge, our nations leader, The guy that does make the final decision when it comes to our nation....and in this time of crises  I would hope he is making those decisions...

I wouldn't blame him if this was a village and Dr Tam was our only Dr, but he has more than just her and the WHO to get info from. 

Quote

For Canada to be beaten by the world’s poorest continent is a humiliation. Can it be that Canada lacks the scientists, laboratories or wealth to do better? Certainly not. The fault instead lies in the cupidity and stupidity of our governments—for while the agent of the pandemic is a virus, the cause of Canada’s failure lies in its political choices

That would have me in hysterical laughter if not for the accompanying death toll. 

Not only is Canada 39th in population, 187th in pop density, and 11th in covid deaths, we are also a very wealthy country compared to a lot of the places that are just totally kicking our ass on covid. 

All things considered, we are definitely the worst imo.

If we had a subway like NYC with 4.3M people riding it per day, in an area that's the size of Vancouver Island with 20M people, even our goldfish would all be dead. Covid viruses the size of VW beetles would be chasing us around like a bunch of Pacmans. I'm exaggerating, slightly.

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12 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

The entire rest of the world understands this. You're literally the only person making this bizarre claim.

I'm the only person on the entire planet who says that thousands upon thousands of flights continued to pour into the US?  That is bizarre.

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50 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I'm the only person on the entire planet who says that thousands upon thousands of flights continued to pour into the US?  That is bizarre.

Did Japan have a travel ban, or did they not? Did Taiwan have a travel ban, or did they not?

Are you saying that travel bans weren't an effective part of Japan's fight against Covid? 

Are you saying that it's not important to ban travel from a place that's known to have a dangerous viral outbreak starting? 

What's your great plan eyeball? Can you tell me how Japan got it wrong, and how you'd do it better? 

Right from the start of the pandemic you had all the wrong guesses, you put your faith in people who were saying and doing the exact wrong things, and now with the benefit of hindsight, you still don't understand what really happened or you're just refusing to admit the truth. 

I know that you need to portray Trump as a huge, heartless dictator who'd throw anyone under the bus to save his own skin, but this topic leaves your fantasy unsupported. Trump understands that every American has the inalienable right to come home, travel ban be damned. Even our own PM, whose love of Canadians is questionable, allowed Canadians to return after he banned travellers from other countries (except on business). 

All the mature, intelligent people have moved past this point eyeball. You're the only holdout. 

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57 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

All the mature, intelligent people have moved past this point eyeball. You're the only holdout.

Yes well recall it was a child in the Emperor's New Clothes who pointed out the moral of the story.  Translated into over 100 languages and nearly 200 years later and millions upon millions of mature self-described intelligent people still refuse to get it.

Edited by eyeball

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27 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Yes well recall it was a child in the Emperor's New Clothes who pointed out the moral of the story.  Translated into over 100 languages and nearly 200 years later and millions upon millions of adults still refuse to get it.

So this is like CNN's New Clothes? Credibility is clothing? 

They don't have shoes on (they got caught lying about Russian collusion), they don't have a shirt on (they got caught lying about Ukrainian collusion), they don't have pants on (they got successfully sued by a high school kid for defamation of character) they don't have underwear on (they got caught lying about Kavanaugh), etc, etc.

"There was no travel ban - Trump let Americans come home!!!!!!!" - CNN

"Look at the Emperor's new story!!!! CNN has to be believed!" - eyeball

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55 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Yes well recall it was a child in the Emperor's New Clothes who pointed out the moral of the story. 

Let's use a Danish fairly tale to determine national policy issues...

Cuckoo   :blink:

Cuckoo   :blink:

Cuckoo   :blink:

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19 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Let's use a Danish fairly tale to determine national policy issues...

Cuckoo   :blink:

Cuckoo   :blink:

Cuckoo   :blink:

Close but the story's real utility in this case lies in demonstrating how right-wing conservative cuckoos insert their hubris and false premises into their worldview and by extension the national policy issues they like to advance.  Trump's proclamation of having banned travellers is no different than the Emperor strutting about in clothes that only exist in his and his sycophants imagination.  

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How Canada bungled its response to Covid-19. And continues to bungle it. In Macleans of all places. It's not often you see such criticism of the Liberals in Macleans. But it's well-deserved. As is the criticism of Ontario and Quebec. They have both screwed up royally, and have continued to do so. They were unprepared and haven't learned from their lack of preparedness. Nor have they learned much from other countries who have gotten the disease under control. Nor is there any indication things are getting better.

Our progress on “bending the curve” is halting and unimpressive compared to Europe and Asia. Our testing is so broken down that it lags behind Rwanda’s and Ethiopia’s. Our epidemiological data is so inadequate that even if we wanted to conduct the endgame well, often we cannot. Places like Toronto and Quebec are reopening too soon, risking to sicken—and kill—people needlessly, while the Maritimes and Prairies are reopening too slowly, strangling the economy.

Simply put, Canada is bungling its most significant peacetime crisis in a century.  That is why I am writing this sequel not just as a health scientist, but also as a constitutional lawyer—because the seeds of our failure are everywhere.

Instead of the successful nosedive in France, Germany, Spain, or Switzerland—a feat their governments achieved despite a faster climb and higher peak—Canada’s curve resembles an undulating plateau or bunny ski hill.  By May 25, Canada was in the same place as April 4—fully seven wasted weeks, littered with thousands of dead.

https://www.macleans.ca/society/health/how-canada-has-bungled-the-covid-19-endgame/

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19 hours ago, WestCanMan said:

I wouldn't blame him if this was a village and Dr Tam was our only Dr, but he has more than just her and the WHO to get info from. 

That would have me in hysterical laughter if not for the accompanying death toll. 

Not only is Canada 39th in population, 187th in pop density, and 11th in covid deaths, we are also a very wealthy country compared to a lot of the places that are just totally kicking our ass on covid. 

All things considered, we are definitely the worst imo.

If we had a subway like NYC with 4.3M people riding it per day, in an area that's the size of Vancouver Island with 20M people, even our goldfish would all be dead. Covid viruses the size of VW beetles would be chasing us around like a bunch of Pacmans. I'm exaggerating, slightly.

What really gets me fired up, like a red neck on payday,  is the liberals that blindly support Justin and band of liars and crack pots, will not see just how badly this crises , or should I say what a cluster F*** this really is.

A recent poll has said the majority of Canadians believe that Justin handled this crises like a champ, I mean either we are such a stupid people, or we really are plugged into that liberal propaganda machine and believe everything that comes out of it... I use the ban on guns as a prime example, nobody has the time or wants to put in the effort to just google that shit, to see if what they are being feed is true or not...and even when presented with the truth or facts they still refuse to change the channel, JUSTIN told me it's true, I don't want to hear the truth it hurts....

I really hope these new Conservatives have a brand new plan to set this country back on track...so far I'm not really sure if the present candidates are up to the task... 

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8 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

What really gets me fired up, like a red neck on payday,  is the liberals that blindly support Justin and band of liars and crack pots, will not see just how badly this crises , or should I say what a cluster F*** this really is.

A recent poll has said the majority of Canadians believe that Justin handled this crises like a champ, I mean either we are such a stupid people, or we really are plugged into that liberal propaganda machine and believe everything that comes out of it... I use the ban on guns as a prime example, nobody has the time or wants to put in the effort to just google that shit, to see if what they are being feed is true or not...and even when presented with the truth or facts they still refuse to change the channel, JUSTIN told me it's true, I don't want to hear the truth it hurts....

I really hope these new Conservatives have a brand new plan to set this country back on track...so far I'm not really sure if the present candidates are up to the task... 

They see him every single day speaking calmly and giving out billions of dollars to every group in sight. The media is very liberal-friendly, and hardly ever is a discouraging word heard from them, especially the CBC. Meanwhile, where are the conservatives? Scheer is widely unpopular and on his way out, and can hardly ever get any screen time. Nor does he have much of interest to say when he does. There is no house of commons. Asking questions over a video conference system is supremely unexciting for the media, and it lacks the sense of office and gravitas that standing in the House does. And too many Canadians only know we're doing better than the Americans. That seems enough, whether it's on health care or pandemics, crime or poverty or leadership.

Edited by Argus
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36 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

What really gets me fired up, like a red neck on payday,  is the liberals that blindly support Justin and band of liars and crack pots, will not see just how badly this crises , or should I say what a cluster F*** this really is.

A recent poll has said the majority of Canadians believe that Justin handled this crises like a champ, I mean either we are such a stupid people, or we really are plugged into that liberal propaganda machine and believe everything that comes out of it... I use the ban on guns as a prime example, nobody has the time or wants to put in the effort to just google that shit, to see if what they are being feed is true or not...and even when presented with the truth or facts they still refuse to change the channel, JUSTIN told me it's true, I don't want to hear the truth it hurts....

I really hope these new Conservatives have a brand new plan to set this country back on track...so far I'm not really sure if the present candidates are up to the task... 

Liberal voters are just people who are easily led around by their emotions. Logic doesn't factor heavily into their thought process.

Some people didn't see the logic of how bad the direction from Trudeau/Tam/the WHO really was at the onset, so when they look back on it with the benefit of hindsight they think it was a reasonable course of action to take at the time. They reacted to Trudeau's emotion about how "racist" a travel ban is and that's all they really care about.

The emotional reaction to the gun ban is obvious. No matter what happens with guns, it's emotional. The true facts of the case just fall on deaf ears when you are competing with the shriek of "GUNS JUST KILL PEOPLE!!!!". 

Honestly, I'm starting to see Lib/Dem voters becoming so completely programmed by the MSM that it's at the point where they can be told absolutely any blatant lie and they'll believe it. 

I've gone from the point where, as a younger person I would have risked my life to protect this country to now, where if someone comes to take over I'd be really tempted to just join them. 

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