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This is now very little ability to disagree with the Left

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2 hours ago, Shady said:

That will change when people get to know the political platform of the movement.  Like ending capitalism and defunding the police.  

 

Yup....some folks seem to like the idea of 401k-s and retirement. But working in an Anitifa re-education camp until death would be much more appropriate for these Nazis.

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2 hours ago, Shady said:

That will change when people get to know the political platform of the movement.  Like ending capitalism and defunding the police.  

You can only hope so.  They have a cop strangling someone right now and that seems to be enough.  'Defunding the police' is also not something that people should automatically be against, any more than education or health cuts... 

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6 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

You can only hope so.  They have a cop strangling someone right now and that seems to be enough.  'Defunding the police' is also not something that people should automatically be against, any more than education or health cuts... 

Yes, some of their "demands" are completely insane and have almost zero pubic support.  What people support is some police reform.

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Just now, Shady said:

Yes, some of their "demands" are completely insane and have almost zero pubic support.  What people support is some police reform.

Well, they are simply a protest group, like the Tea Party.  They will go away when there is some change, I expect.  The Tea Party went away when Trump got elected and eliminated deficits... oh... wait... :(

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6 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Well, they are simply a protest group, like the Tea Party.  They will go away when there is some change, I expect.  The Tea Party went away when Trump got elected and eliminated deficits... oh... wait... :(

They are kind of like the Tea Party, except the Tea Party was peaceful and didn't destroy private and public property, assault people and kill people.

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13 minutes ago, Shady said:

They are kind of like the Tea Party, except the Tea Party was peaceful and didn't destroy private and public property, assault people and kill people.

It's pretty easy to just lump them all together though, right?  Much less thinking involved.  All the protestors are vandals, murders and thugs.  The Tea Party was the picture of calm and reason...except for all of those Affordable Care rallies they crashed and derailed...sometimes violently.  These protestors are also not showing up with assault rifles at state facilities. 

Shady you're smarter than that.  

 

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1 minute ago, Moonbox said:

It's pretty easy to just lump them all together though, right?  Much less thinking involved.  All the protestors are vandals, murders and thugs.  The Tea Party was the picture of calm and reason...except for all of those Affordable Care rallies they crashed and derailed...sometimes violently.  These protestors are also not showing up with assault rifles at state facilities. 

Shady you're smarter than that.  

 

Surely you can't be comparing the violence and the destruction we're seeing now to anything resembling the Tea Party protests?  That's as disingenuous as it gets.  But I remember the mainstream media coming out strongly against the Tea Party protests, as opposed to the mainstream media cheerleading we're seeing today.  Interesting.

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24 minutes ago, Shady said:

They are kind of like the Tea Party, except the Tea Party was peaceful and didn't destroy private and public property, assault people and kill people.

Oh, sorry BLM killed people ?  I didn't know.  The 'private property' thing is always nebulous...

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It's not their statues to take down.  Regardless, historical context is important.  And now the North American Taliban is removing Jefferson, Adams, Washington and Lincoln statues. 

I already explained that they're not the Taliban.  Maybe those idiots who stormed the Michigan legislature can be called Taliban because they feel strongly about haircuts ?

Quote

No, that's not true, you should read Team of Rivals, it's a great book on Lincoln.  You should also read the Lincoln/Douglas debates.

That does sound like a good book but I believe he is quoted in the debates. “I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races"

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The liberals and the NDP should be defunded.

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21 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Oh, sorry BLM killed people ?  I didn't know.  The 'private property' thing is always nebulous...

I already explained that they're not the Taliban.  Maybe those idiots who stormed the Michigan legislature can be called Taliban because they feel strongly about haircuts ?

That does sound like a good book but I believe he is quoted in the debates. “I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races"

They are no better than the taliban . Destroying our history should get you a jail cell. The michigan idiots should have been shot on site. The extreme right and extreme left are ruining everything.

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27 minutes ago, Shady said:

Surely you can't be comparing the violence and the destruction we're seeing now to anything resembling the Tea Party protests?  That's as disingenuous as it gets.  But I remember the mainstream media coming out strongly against the Tea Party protests, as opposed to the mainstream media cheerleading we're seeing today.  Interesting.

Surely you're not comparing the deep-rooted issues behind the current protests, to a bunch of ignorant, uneducated white slobs protesting free healthcare?  How many Tea Party protesters did the policy kill?  Talk about being disingenuous.  

I read and watch a lot of news, and I've yet to see anyone "cheerleading" the violent protests.  The hypocrisy of your position is highlighted by the threats from Trump etc against protests in Seattle or Atlanta, and then his overt "cheerleading" of white trash occupying statehouses and brandishing assault weapons.  

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It seems BLM must answer for all the vandalism and the actions of all the people that turn out to these protests. 

Yet when someone is killed counter protesting a rally against a General Lee statue being removed in Charlottesville, that's an isolated incident and people shouldn't have to answer for the Neo Nazis that came to that rally. 

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5 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

Surely you're not comparing the deep-rooted issues behind the current protests, to a bunch of ignorant, uneducated white slobs protesting free healthcare?  How many Tea Party protesters did the policy kill?  Talk about being disingenuous.  

I read and watch a lot of news, and I've yet to see anyone "cheerleading" the violent protests.  The hypocrisy of your position is highlighted by the threats from Trump etc against protests in Seattle or Atlanta, and then his overt "cheerleading" of white trash occupying statehouses and brandishing assault weapons.  

Your stereotypes are as shallow as your argument.  There were very legitimate reasons that people didn't want their health care changed.  They wanted to keep their doctor.  Imagine that?  They wanted to keep their plan.  Because they liked it.  Regardless, these current protests have shown the worst of humanity.  Destroying public and private property.  Assaulting people, assaulting police officers.  Killing police officers.  Nothing at all comparable to the Tea Party protests or the Michigan protests which were completely peaceful.  Hey remember when the Tea Party took over 7 blocks of a city and called it there own country???? LOL!

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40 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

Oh, sorry BLM killed people ?  I didn't know.  The 'private property' thing is always nebulous...

I already explained that they're not the Taliban.  Maybe those idiots who stormed the Michigan legislature can be called Taliban because they feel strongly about haircuts ?

That does sound like a good book but I believe he is quoted in the debates. “I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races"

What's nebulous about private property?  Do you need it explained to you?    Once again, you know it's not about haircuts.  It was being able to open their businesses to provide for their families.  That would be like me characterizing the protests as about free televisions.  Grow up already.  Hey remember when the Michigan protesters took over several city blocks and called it their own country!?  LOL!!!!

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19 minutes ago, PIK said:

They are no better than the taliban . Destroying our history should get you a jail cell. The michigan idiots should have been shot on site. The extreme right and extreme left are ruining everything.

The so-called Michigan idiots didn't break one single law or damage once piece of private or public property.

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Next the new progressive Taliban will be burning books and renaming cities.

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Just now, Shady said:

1. What's nebulous about private property?   
2. Once again, you know it's not about haircuts. 
3. That would be like me characterizing the protests as about free televisions.
4. Hey remember when the Michigan protesters took over several city blocks and called it their own country!?  LOL!!!!

1. It's nebulous because the value of the damage vs. what is being protested is very germane and not brought up.
2. I don't agree.
3. Well, get into the details.  A single statue being pulled down - what is the upside of that ?  There is some, please characterize it for me.
4. You are comically unaware of subjectivity.  I am fine with people complaining about what you complain about, as long as they allow people who protest AGAINST their values to take the same liberties.

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1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

1. It's nebulous because the value of the damage vs. what is being protested is very germane and not brought up.
2. I don't agree.
3. Well, get into the details.  A single statue being pulled down - what is the upside of that ?  There is some, please characterize it for me.
4. You are comically unaware of subjectivity.  I am fine with people complaining about what you complain about, as long as they allow people who protest AGAINST their values to take the same liberties.

The value of damage is irrelevant.  It's against the law.  You don't agree because you refuse to accept the facts.  As usual you have your head in the sand.  Business owners have been sent to jail for not getting haircuts, but opening their businesses to serve customers.  Restaurants, bars, gyms, salons, etc.   What about those facts do you disagree with?  You're entitled to your own opinion, but not you're own facts.  But you're ultimately a hypocrite.  If conservative protesters behaved in the same manner as these leftwing thugs, you'd be criticizing them, and rightly so.  Assaulting people and damaging property is against the law, and is not a constitutional right.  I'm all in favour of protests.  Not this nonsense.  You're the North American Taliban.  Deal with it.  Own it.

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13 minutes ago, Shady said:

Your stereotypes are as shallow as your argument.  There were very legitimate reasons that people didn't want their health care changed.  They wanted to keep their doctor.  Imagine that?  They wanted to keep their plan.  Because they liked it.  Regardless, these current protests have shown the worst of humanity.  Destroying public and private property.  Assaulting people, assaulting police officers.  Killing police officers.  Nothing at all comparable to the Tea Party protests or the Michigan protests which were completely peaceful.  Hey remember when the Tea Party took over 7 blocks of a city and called it there own country???? LOL!

My stereotypes are over the top and meant to highlight your hypocrisy.  Both of us can oversimplify and generalize an argument unfairly.  

To compare the Tea Party to the current protests is beyond foolish.  On the one hand, we're dealing with decades of black people being basically murdered by police, and on the other hand you have a small minority of goofs complaining about "big government".  

They're so far apart that a comparison is worthless.  

Again, nobody reasonable is supporting looting and violence, but that seems to be the argument you're making here.  The mainstream media is glorifying vandals and murderers and encouraging the mob to burn it all down.  I'm not doing that.  Who's doing that, exactly? 

Please...

Edited by Moonbox

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14 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

My stereotypes are over the top and meant to highlight your hypocrisy.  Both of us can oversimplify and generalize an argument unfairly.  

To compare the Tea Party to the current protests is beyond foolish.  On the one hand, we're dealing with decades of black people being basically murdered by police, and on the other hand you have a small minority of goofs complaining about "big government".  

They're so far apart that a comparison is worthless.  

Again, nobody reasonable is supporting looting and violence, but that seems to be the argument you're making here.  The mainstream media is glorifying vandals and murderers and encouraging the mob to burn it all down.  I'm not doing that.  Who's doing that, exactly? 

Please...

Your disingenuous and intellectually dishonest.  Yes, the mainstream media is glorifying and supporting this action.  CNN anchor "Who said protests were suppose to be peaceful?".  The hypocrisy of you people is simply stunning.  Especially when compared to the protests in Michigan.  

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14 hours ago, Independent1986 said:

You think China created the virus to get back at Trump or he was referring at someone else ? Don't you realize that is the same as the left saying that there are armies of white supremacists at the gates. Sometimes, It is so easy to point at someone's flaws according to us, I just did it with MH, I am flawed :D, but it is very hard to look in the mirror. 

No, I don't think China created the virus to get back at Trump. Nor do I take much of what Trump says seriously.

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17 minutes ago, Shady said:

1. The value of damage is irrelevant.  It's against the law. 
2. You don't agree because you refuse to accept the facts.   As usual you have your head in the sand. 
3. Business owners have been sent to jail for not getting haircuts, but opening their businesses to serve customers. 
4. But you're ultimately a hypocrite. 
5. If conservative protesters behaved in the same manner as these leftwing thugs, you'd be criticizing them, and rightly so. 
6. Assaulting people and damaging property is against the law, and is not a constitutional right.  I'm all in favour of protests.  Not this nonsense. 
7. You're the North American Taliban.  Deal with it.  Own it.

1. I disagree.  And if you were against 'breaking the law' absolutely then you would be speaking out against Covidiots also.  Are you, now ?
2. 1_4911887.jpg

3. Ok.  Well doesn't your "it's against the law" maxim apply here ?  If not, why not ?  Because operating a small business is more important than the law I guess.  But protesting against symbols of slavery isn't, I guess.  That's subjectivity. 
4. No, you are showing hypocrisy by claiming your values as facts and not understanding subjectivity. Also note I didn't call you "a hypocrite" here, but said you were "showing hypocrisy" which is the difference between insulting a person and criticizing behaviour.
5. No, I wouldn't.  There's such a nebulousness around group behaviour, damage caused and so on that it's impossible to lay out a maxim to capture it.  You would have the hairdresser praised for refusing to comply with the law but the protestor tearing down a racist symbol is blameworthy to you.  I actually don't have a strong position, ie. a maxim, on either one but will look at the value.  You seem to think I'm not empathetic to conservatives which is a paranoid and delusional opinion IMO
6. I agree that assaulting people isn't conscionable but it doesn't invalidate an entire movement unless it's endemic to that movement.
7. You have a pathological need to demonize people who disagree with you slightly, which I don't understand.
 

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14 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

And I wonder how many of those people know that BLM leaders are Marxists and want to do away with Capitalism.

Or how many are too scared to say they don't approve of them. Heck, a BC university board chair had to resign and offer up cringing apologies on the weekend for simply liking a couple of tweets critical of BLM.

 

Edited by Argus

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12 hours ago, dialamah said:

If what you say is true, it might be worth considering that Asian and South Asian chose to come to North America.  Black people were brought to North America against their will, to be enslaved.

The Black people in Canada came here willingly.

  Indigenous people had their land taken, their culture destroyed, their children taken and were forced onto reservation

Indigenous people had no issues with taking land from each other, and committing genocide against each other. That was simply how war worked.

Edited by Argus
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2 hours ago, Shady said:

Yes, some of their "demands" are completely insane and have almost zero pubic support.  What people support is some police reform.

I think I said this before, but as one of the black guys in a video I cited said, if BLM actually represented the will of black Americans Joe Biden would not be the Democratic candidate.

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