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1 minute ago, sharkman said:

Petros, don’t read your own press clippings.  There wouldn’t be civil war, States would leave the union peacefully.  
As I see it, the main stream media is the root cause for 90% of the discord. The last 20 years have been atrocious.  The hate  for Bush Jr, the worship of Obama and then the 4 years of shrieking over Trump.

There have been a number of changes in the US which has led to more division. But if you want the guilty party it's this guy here.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2018/11/newt-gingrich-says-youre-welcome/570832/

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Update, I just made a donation to your gofundme for Breonna.  The wager was fun, right up until the end.  Thanks for being a good sport, and enjoy the next 4 years.

Truth.  

But the fraud has been completely visible, no faith involved.  It actually takes more “faith” to look at the various videos and claim you see no fraud.

Posted Images

28 minutes ago, Argus said:

There have been a number of changes in the US which has led to more division. But if you want the guilty party it's this guy here.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2018/11/newt-gingrich-says-youre-welcome/570832/

A dirty politician?  Bill Clinton was far more dirty and slimy.  
We could trade names of dirty politicians all day.  I don’t think that gets to the heart of the matter of how the media became lap dogs of the Dems and Reps.  Something is deeply wrong with this picture and it’s not just one side.  It’s both sides.

The MSM WIDELY claimed that the Hunter Biden story was a Russian hoax before the election, do you remember that?  Now after the election the same media outlets are reporting it VERY differently.  They did that to protect Biden’s election chances, you realize this, yes?  And Fox was trying to protect Trump, can you see that this is lying to the public to advance their agendas?

They have become propaganda arms of their respective political parties.  It’s the exact opposite of what the news organizations were supposed to be.  And it’s wrong.  

it’s criminal to push some narratives and suppress others to manipulate the public.

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3 minutes ago, sharkman said:

A dirty politician?  Bill Clinton was far more dirty and slimy.  
We could trade names of dirty politicians all day.  I don’t think that gets to the heart of the matter of how the media became lap dogs of the Dems and Reps.  Something is deeply wrong with this picture and it’s not just one side.  It’s both sides.

The MSM WIDELY claimed that the Hunter Biden story was a Russian hoax before the election, do you remember that?  Now after the election the same media outlets are reporting it VERY differently.  They did that to protect Biden’s election chances, you realize this, yes?  And Fox was trying to protect Trump, can you see that this is lying to the public to advance their agendas?

They have become propaganda arms of their respective political parties.  It’s the exact opposite of what the news organizations were supposed to be.  And it’s wrong.  

it’s criminal to push some narratives and suppress others to manipulate the public.

It's not criminal for a media outlet to be politically biased.  Even the BBC have admitted a leftwing bias, and have actually stated a desire to combat it.  It's not even criminal to lie in the media.  If it was, there would be far fewer media outlets, and no right wing outlets whatsoever.

It is incumbent on us to think, as well, and not be taken in by the rantings of the mob.  I don't read The National Enquirer, and I don't put any stock whatsoever in anything I hear on any social media.  I'll never get my news from a YouTube basement dweller, of any political stripe.

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52 minutes ago, sharkman said:

A dirty politician?  Bill Clinton was far more dirty and slimy.  

You didn't read the cite. It was basically about how Gingrich set out to make partisanship more bitter and intractable, and to oppose compromises. Another of the things he did was to change the schedule for when congress meets so that congressmen can go home every weekend. Prior to that they stayed in Washington and got to know each other better. That doesn't happen now.

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The MSM WIDELY claimed that the Hunter Biden story was a Russian hoax before the election, do you remember that?  Now after the election the same media outlets are reporting it VERY differently.

No, they're not. All they've reported was that Donald Trump's justice department has been investigating him for two years. That's not exactly a big surprise given Trump has been demanding investigations into the Bidens just so he could say they were under investigations. It's why he blackmailed Ukraine.

As for media becoming propaganda arms. You should go and look up the Fairness Doctrine. It was an FCC rule which required broadcasters to be somewhat even-handed in how they treated politics. It was abolished by the Republicans under Reagan.

 

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21 minutes ago, Argus said:

You didn't read the cite. It was basically about how Gingrich set out to make partisanship more bitter and intractable, and to oppose compromises. Another of the things he did was to change the schedule for when congress meets so that congressmen can go home every weekend. Prior to that they stayed in Washington and got to know each other better. That doesn't happen now.

No, they're not. All they've reported was that Donald Trump's justice department has been investigating him for two years. That's not exactly a big surprise given Trump has been demanding investigations into the Bidens just so he could say they were under investigations. It's why he blackmailed Ukraine.

As for media becoming propaganda arms. You should go and look up the Fairness Doctrine. It was an FCC rule which required broadcasters to be somewhat even-handed in how they treated politics. It was abolished by the Republicans under Reagan.

 

I read the first 2 pages then realized that the author hadn't gotten to the main part of what he/she wanted to say about Gingrich.  I hate long winded people, they tend to be full of themselves.  It began to take shape as just another opinion piece.  From a liberal minded person.  I need more than opinion.

I don't think you realize what happened around the Hunter Biden story in the run up to the election.  The New York Post broke the story on Twitter.  Twitter immediately shut them down.  Peter Schiif publicly stated that it was a Russian disinformation story.  CNN, MSNBC, NBC and most other of the MSM all publicly stated that it was some kind of Russian information operation.  You seem unaware of this.  That's how the story was shut down by MSM and big tech.

Then the election happened, and we never heard another word about this story from the MSM.  But last week, Hunter Biden announced that he was under investigation for tax issues, and now the MSM is allowed to talk about it.  Now we find out that the FBI has been investigating him for 2 years.  In the same way, the MSM is suppressing the instances of voter fraud.  They have a free hand to shape the news any way they want.

Okay, let's blame Reagan.  Whomever is to blame, you seem okay with the fact that the media regularly lies and manipulates.  I'm not okay with that.  It needs to be fixed.  It's causing a huge rift between the left and right in America and people are getting hurt.  

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Argus, here's a nice opinion piece that you won't like, it's from a conservative and blames Bill Clinton's Telecommunication Act of 1996, which relaxed ownership laws, allowed media monopolies owned by a few rich people.  I suppose you think Clinton is innocent?

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I discovered the other day, the deregulation [Telecommunications Act] that allowed for cross-media outlets to coalesce under a single owner was signed under President Bill Clinton, not President George W. Bush as I’ve proclaimed several times in various formats. My sincere apologies for this misleading information. I also discovered it was President Ronald Reagan who got rid of the Fairness Doctrine (FCC rule from 1949-87) for radio and broadcast mediums. These two actions are primary contributors to our current partisan divide.

Think of the McLaughlin Report as a Fairness Doctrine representation. A mediator with two peered individuals debating a subject from objective viewpoints, peered being key to the fairness aspect. This allows the audience to hear dissenting positions and format their own opinion.

With the recension of this doctrine, right-wing talk-radio arose, and then partisan news in its many formats today. These singular perspectives act as propaganda machines (intentional or not) and inflame our partisan bickering by labeling or alluding to the political opposition as enemy.

 

 

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1 hour ago, bcsapper said:

It's not criminal for a media outlet to be politically biased.  Even the BBC have admitted a leftwing bias, and have actually stated a desire to combat it.  It's not even criminal to lie in the media.  If it was, there would be far fewer media outlets, and no right wing outlets whatsoever.

It is incumbent on us to think, as well, and not be taken in by the rantings of the mob.  I don't read The National Enquirer, and I don't put any stock whatsoever in anything I hear on any social media.  I'll never get my news from a YouTube basement dweller, of any political stripe.

It’s wrong for any media outlet to be biased.   But what they are doing these days is beyond reckless.  

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3 minutes ago, sharkman said:

It’s wrong for any media outlet to be biased.   But what they are doing these days is beyond reckless.  

I don't see how it's possible for there to be no bias at all.  To prefer is human, and it would be an unusual journalist indeed that was able to keep such preferences out of his or her work completely.  The main way respectable media express bias is by omission.  I remember discussing this before on here.  An outlet will report an event accurately, but omit certain details that don't quite fit their preferred narrative.  That's okay.  Find it somewhere else, if you're interested.

Any media that out and out lies does not deserve one's patronage, and therefore should not enter into the discussion, except as a source of derision.  Unless one is overly partisan, in which case these outlets are probably the only ones visited.

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40 minutes ago, sharkman said:

I read the first 2 pages then realized that the author hadn't gotten to the main part of what he/she wanted to say about Gingrich.  I hate long winded people, they tend to be full of themselves.  It began to take shape as just another opinion piece.  From a liberal minded person.  I need more than opinion.

Some things are too complicated to be readily absorbed in a page or two. Sometimes you have to read longer. Simplistic summaries are rarely very enlightening.

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I don't think you realize what happened around the Hunter Biden story in the run up to the election.  The New York Post broke the story on Twitter. 

 

Spare me. Rudy Giulliani came up with this story, probably fed to him by the Russian agents he has been associated with for the past couple of years. He presented it to FOX and FOX asked to examine the evidence. He refused (for SOME reason) so they took a pass.

Right here is where you ought to be questioning just how truthful the story is.

He presented it to one of the cheapest tabloids in the US, the NY Post, run by a devoted Trump fan. They printed it, but none of their journalists would write the story or be associated with it for the same reason FOX wouldn't.

Right here you ought to once again be questioning just how truthful the story is.

Last time around, according to every western intelligence agency, Russia did its best to change the outcome to ensure their favored son - Trump - won.

Right here is where you ought to be wondering why every western intelligence agency - and the US Senate intelligence committee run by Republicans - all say Russia wanted Trump to win.

So this time around social media and the MSM were determined not to be willing participants in Russia's efforts. Since Giulliani was pushing a story which had no evidence and very shady origins, they weren't going to run with it. Good on them.

Now Biden himself has announced the Trump Justice Department is investigating him. That's hardly evidence of anything given what a shit stain of a man Donald Trump is. Anyone watching him would know that had he the power all Democrats would be in prison along with all others, including the media who questioned him. I would have been surprised that there wasn't a federal investigation into Biden.

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Whomever is to blame, you seem okay with the fact that the media regularly lies and manipulates.  I'm not okay with that. 

Yes, you are. You're perfectly fine with it except when the media seems biased against your living orange God. Then you get livid.

As for me, I have written many times about the biases in the media. I'm not the hypocrite here.

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23 hours ago, Infidel Dog said:

  

 

Beave, you live in your own little world and have no idea what I or anybody else knows or believes. But that doesn't seem to be a problem for you because reality for you becomes whatever you want to believe or are told to believe by what people call "They." (ie "They" censor, control and corrupt the message.)

And the difference between somebody like me and somebody like you is me and mine don't just have access to information from one side of the issue. We're forced to deal with both sides, because the MSM or what I call the corporate left's side is put right in front of our faces and we lack the pressure of a Prog's habitual tendency to ignore the obvious when we weigh what seems to be a rational conclusion once in possession of all that information.

For example when we see a preponderance of evidence telling us Joe Biden's cracked up son has forgotten his laptop at a computer shop and it is now a possession of the shop owner and the FBI, we're going to listen and give what we learn all credence rationality suggests is now blatant.

You on the other hand will be told to believe the Russians did it and what is suggested by discoveries on the laptop as being the obvious to us will become in your strange alternate reality something you'll call "a conspiracy theory."

And now that even your media is admitting we were right all along I wait with baited breath to hear what the new reality has become in Beave World.

And this sort of thing happens all the time.

This is hilarious Trump supporters are the most brainwashed and out of touch people in the world living in your own fantasy-filled bubble where you categorically reject all inconvenient truths and fabricate your own fictions and conspiracies

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23 hours ago, Infidel Dog said:

Now as far as the lawsuits go here's what's happened so far. 

All who stayed up to watch the election were told counting was shut down so go to Bed. At that time Trump was in the lead and looked to be comfortably on the way to victory. When we woke up we discovered they had lied to us and had been counting what they were calling "the vote" all night.

THIS  IS FLASE

And then the stories started coming in about poll watchers being corralled hundreds of feet from the count or pushed out of the buildings to Prog cheers. We saw a video of street people carrying sacks or pulling wagons of suddenly discovered ballots into a counting hall early in the morning after everybody else had been told to leave. We saw Bristol board barriers put up to prevent anybody seeing through viewing windows to the counting area. 

CLIPS OF NORMAL ACTIVITY AND OF EVENTS TAKEN OUT OF CONTEXT E.G.  - BRISTOL BOARD WHEN UP AFTER TRUMP SUPPORTERS TRIED STORMING THE FACILITY AND TAKING PICTURES OF ELECTION WORKERS 

And as these and other reports continued and grew lawyers were called. 

LAWYERS WERE CALLED FIRST THEN THE ACCUSATIONS WERE MADE UP LATER 

They put requests forward to suspend the count in front of what was at first the organization responsible for the cheat. They were, or course, denied.

BECAUSE THEIR ACCUSATIONS WERE BULLSHIT AND BASR

And the voice of "They" told it's people it was because there was no evidence. 

THERE WAS NO EVIDENCE  AND THERE IS NO VAST CONSPIRACY 

The requests to slow things down continued and as time passed evidence was acquired. And even judges from both sides were called in. None wanted anything to do with the argument and requests to listen to the evidence were thrown out on procedural grounds or told the evidence acquired the court had yet to allow be presented in a full court case didn't exist.

And now the Supreme court seems similarly reluctant to be forced into a place where they have to judge the evidence too, but cases continue to arrive and who knows? Maybe it will happen.

The electoral counts haven't been sent to the electoral college yet by the legislatures and until they do there's still a long shot chance, justice will be done, the steal can be stopped, and America can be saved.

Trumps claims have been treated as baseless by every court and state official including Republican ones and Trumps own Attorney General. Because they are baseless accusations.
 

Dont you think it’s funny that everything that has happened is exactly what is supposed to happen if the  claims  were baseless ?  Everyone who is in a position to objectively review trumps claim and speak with authority on the subject has said the claims are baseless. Including fellow Republicans and Trumps own appointed judges and AG. These are people who have no reason to lie ir aide with Democrats and every reason to support Trump if his claim had merit.  Why won’t you believe them?

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3 minutes ago, BeaverFever said:

This is hilarious Trump supporters are the most brainwashed and out of touch people in the world living in your own fantasy-filled bubble where you categorically reject all inconvenient truths and fabricate your own fictions and conspiracies

haha, What is wrong with you???? may be they are Biden haters which I am too. I believe Trump is a fxxking big mouth SOB too. OTH, I know Biden is a racist southern crooked dems. So, personally, Trump /  Pence vs Biden / Harris, I rather have the former pair in the WH.  

Back to the lawsuits, it is his right. So, it is what it is. In terms of the election, they better clean the mail-in voters issues before the next election

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THE FBI IS INVESTIGATING HUNTER BIDEN.  THAT'S.  THE.  F.B.I.

link one

 

link two

 

link three

 

link four  -  IRS and FBI, thanks CNN

 

The justice department is also investigating Hunter Biden

 

Again, before the election, twitter shut down the New York Post as they tried to report on this.  They had Hunter Biden's laptop.  They had his business partner, who had records of their emails and phone texts.  It was all shut down by claiming it was Russia and Guiliani.  There is an email that says that Joe Biden is to get 10 million out of one of the deals within China.  

 

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3 hours ago, sharkman said:

A dirty politician?  Bill Clinton was far more dirty and slimy.  
We could trade names of dirty politicians all day.  I don’t think that gets to the heart of the matter of how the media became lap dogs of the Dems and Reps.  Something is deeply wrong with this picture and it’s not just one side.  It’s both sides.

The MSM WIDELY claimed that the Hunter Biden story was a Russian hoax before the election, do you remember that?  Now after the election the same media outlets are reporting it VERY differently.  They did that to protect Biden’s election chances, you realize this, yes?  And Fox was trying to protect Trump, can you see that this is lying to the public to advance their agendas?

They have become propaganda arms of their respective political parties.  It’s the exact opposite of what the news organizations were supposed to be.  And it’s wrong.  

it’s criminal to push some narratives and suppress others to manipulate the public.

Bill Clinton lied about getting a blowjob from an intern. Whoop-De-Doo!

Compared to the Trump family, Hunter Biden deserves a Nobel Peace Prize. Interesting how you conveniently want to omit the numerous criminal acts of the Trump children. 

Speaking of propaganda, until recently FOX News was the go-to PR machine for the GOP. However, even FOX has credibility and would not run with the election fraud BS, so the Trump crime syndicate chose a bunch of oddball news organizations.  How reliable is OANN? Breitbart? Infowars?

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2 hours ago, Petros said:

Bill Clinton lied about getting a blowjob from an intern. Whoop-De-Doo!

Compared to the Trump family, Hunter Biden deserves a Nobel Peace Prize. Interesting how you conveniently want to omit the numerous criminal acts of the Trump children. 

Speaking of propaganda, until recently FOX News was the go-to PR machine for the GOP. However, even FOX has credibility and would not run with the election fraud BS, so the Trump crime syndicate chose a bunch of oddball news organizations.  How reliable is OANN? Breitbart? Infowars?

Trump was loved by dems and  Hollywood elite  before he crossed the line. I don't know what had trump family done after he crossed the line. Could you tell me? Then, I highly doubt that you watch Fox news a lot, may be just fox news sunday or bret baier's special report. \
Ya, after Obama, Aung San and many others...... , I think hunter biden should get a nobel peace prize too.

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I think you're all onto something.  Identify any significant problem plaguing American society:

  • Increasing educational gap between peers in other industrialized, democratic country;
  • Drastically increased wealth disparity;
  • Racial disparities in every aspect of life;
  • Mass disillusionment with outdated, ineffective political systems that respond to the needs or corps, but not constituents...

Have any of these gotten significantly better under any administration in the past two decades?  The rate of decline has slowed in some cases, but the decline continues.

The Republican party's prostration before Trump's naked demagoguery has made them the most pressing threat to American Democracy, but declawing them wouldn't solve America's problems at all.  These problems exist absent any political party.

 

 

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8 hours ago, 366h34d said:

Trump was loved by dems and  Hollywood elite  before he crossed the line. I don't know what had trump family done after he crossed the line. Could you tell me? Then, I highly doubt that you watch Fox news a lot, may be just fox news sunday or bret baier's special report. \
 

He became President, and as anyone who has ever run for office, the public took a closer look at Trump and his family, dug up many of their skeletons dating back 40 years. The World found out the image he carefully crafted of himself- the self-made billionaire, was a complete lie. Trump is also a serial rapist, and his family is under investigation by the New York DA for criminal activities spanning decades..

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21 minutes ago, Petros said:

He became President, and as anyone who has ever run for office, the public took a closer look at Trump and his family, dug up many of their skeletons dating back 40 years. The World found out the image he carefully crafted of himself- the self-made billionaire, was a complete lie. Trump is also a serial rapist, and his family is under investigation by the New York DA for criminal activities spanning decades..

Can you share  the source?
I remember he declared bankruptcy few times (???). Other than that, I don't know he was a rapist and mob (wonder how he would get away). May be he was just another Epstein.

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2 hours ago, AYanker76 said:

I think you're all onto something.  Identify any significant problem plaguing American society:

  • Increasing educational gap between peers in other industrialized, democratic country;
  • Drastically increased wealth disparity;
  • Racial disparities in every aspect of life;
  • Mass disillusionment with outdated, ineffective political systems that respond to the needs or corps, but not constituents...

Have any of these gotten significantly better under any administration in the past two decades?  The rate of decline has slowed in some cases, but the decline continues.

The Republican party's prostration before Trump's naked demagoguery has made them the most pressing threat to American Democracy, but declawing them wouldn't solve America's problems at all.  These problems exist absent any political party.

 

 

Do you have raw data back up your pts??

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Just now, 366h34d said:

oh, #metoo 

Anyway, is Sexual Assault = sexual misconduct = rape or what, I mean I am so confused (may be i am old). BTW, did Biden have #metoo too? It starts to feel like everyone has #metoo. 

It should be noted that the majority of the sexual assault allegations levied against Trump were before the #metoo movement began. In fact, this list does not include several of the Women who allege Trump violated them sexually, including a 13 year old girl.

As for Biden, he has had only one sexual assault allegation levied against him. However, the credibility of the accuser has been in question, as she has changed her story and the circumstances of the assault multiple times. Biden does act inappropriate at times, but he is no rapist.

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3 hours ago, Petros said:

It should be noted that the majority of the sexual assault allegations levied against Trump were before the #metoo movement began. In fact, this list does not include several of the Women who allege Trump violated them sexually, including a 13 year old girl.

As for Biden, he has had only one sexual assault allegation levied against him. However, the credibility of the accuser has been in question, as she has changed her story and the circumstances of the assault multiple times. Biden does act inappropriate at times, but he is no rapist.

When was the #metoo movement began? Is it around that time? Anyway, when I said #metoo, I mean it was those "he said she said."  I am sorry that I did not make myself clear. Then, as for Biden, c'mon man, you cannot do that. That is Sarah Silverman's logic

Those cases belittle the #metoo movement. I hated it. It could be a beautiful movement, just saying.  Anyway, it don't really matter now. The movement turned into a leftist's own piggy bank :)

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