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betsy

Immunity Shots

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I've heard from the news that a school in Ontario had suspended a large number of students until they have their immune shots in order (Rubella, mumps, polio etc..,)

I know of a parent who did not give their child the shots that normally are given to children. I think they believe that they do more harm than good. They've also decided not to give the child milk...

Personally as a parent, I'd feel wary taking this risk. I'd feel like playing Russian roulette with my child's health.

What is your take on this?

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Maybe some will see that there are limits to how much choice we're willing to give to parents.

They should have their children immunized. It's obvious isn't it ?

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Maybe some will see that there are limits to how much choice we're willing to give to parents.
The trouble is all vaccines have a small but non-zero chance of a serious adverse reaction including death or permanent disability. Making vaccines mandatory would make the gov't 100% liable for any side effects. This liability problem is made worse since it is often difficult to prove that a sudden reaction was not caused by a vaccine even if it was unrelated.

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I should add that this are what I call from the "tea-tree oil" crowd. Another parent (an avid user user of tea-tree oil) also think that milk is not good for her children. Both are getting their source online.

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Maybe some will see that there are limits to how much choice we're willing to give to parents.

But then again....who are we to interfere?

As for milk, I cannot tell them they're doing the wrong thing. One claims about steroids in milk (who knows what more).

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Guest Warwick Green
Maybe some will see that there are limits to how much choice we're willing to give to parents.

They should have their children immunized. It's obvious isn't it ?

If they want to send their kids to school of course they need to be immunized; otherwise other kids are at risk.

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Maybe some will see that there are limits to how much choice we're willing to give to parents.

They should have their children immunized. It's obvious isn't it ?

If they want to send their kids to school of course they need to be immunized; otherwise other kids are at risk.

Warwick, the other kids that already had immunization are at risk? I thought the un-immunized children were the ones at risk that's why they got turned away from school....

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Maybe some will see that there are limits to how much choice we're willing to give to parents.

But then again....who are we to interfere?

As for milk, I cannot tell them they're doing the wrong thing. One claims about steroids in milk (who knows what more).

Cow's milk has been proven to increase the risk of osteoporosis in women and also leads to acne problems in children. Recent studies are also revealing that milk may increase the risk of heart disease and cancer in certain situations.

Farmers have been using steroids to increase the production of milk by more than 20%. Just like everything else in life, milk should be taken in moderation.

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I've always felt that milk was for cows, I don't drink the stuff as an adult. I do think its over rated,

I'm not sure about the immunization, there is a chance of a serious reaction, you are playing roulette with your child by giving it to him. I erred on the medical side and gave them their shots. Tis a puzzlement....

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The difference between immunisations and milk is rather large.

Not drinking milk is actually not that unreasonable, there is a lot of crap in milk that I'm skeptical of drinking. But I think the benefits likely outweigh the risks.

Not having your kids immunised is a disregard for the health safety of the whole world, and thats not even an exaggeration. It only takes a few not immunised kids to have a disease continue to thrive. Think of the recent mumps outbreak in the US, this is because people got lazy, and now the disease continues.

Small pox was likely eliminated through nearly mandatory vaccination programs.

Everyone should be required to get the vaccinations in order for society to rid itself of some of the biggest diseases of the day. Whooping cough could be gone if people were properly vaccinated, same with mumps.

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Not having your kids immunised is a disregard for the health safety of the whole world, and thats not even an exaggeration. It only takes a few not immunised kids to have a disease continue to thrive. Think of the recent mumps outbreak in the US, this is because people got lazy, and now the disease continues.

Small pox was likely eliminated through nearly mandatory vaccination programs.

Everyone should be required to get the vaccinations in order for society to rid itself of some of the biggest diseases of the day. Whooping cough could be gone if people were properly vaccinated, same with mumps.

Sorry Geoff, you know not what you're speaking about. Our youngest child was the one in 5 million that had an adverse reaction. The other three were fine but the youngest had brain damage from the second round of shots at four months resulting in not being able to speak until four and having psycomotor seizures until seven. Thank God young brains are "plastic" and can repair themselves to a certain extent. Further measles mumps rubella and pertussis shots were "contraindicated" by the medical examiner of health for the province - ie these shots were not to be given. However, every school and public health nurse thought we were some crunchy granola uninformed parents. As parents we had to fight like hell to keep our child from having anymore shots. Our child still gets tetanus polio and diptheria but the other immunizations would result in a fatal reaction this time. We don't want to spend anymore time at the Children's Hospital here with the neurologist so we turn down the ones that will harm our child, but it is a battle. Some kids have died and some are in vegetative states. Our child is now, with intensive speech therapy and interventions, "normal" - and we want to keep it that way. As our family doctor says, it would be better for our child to have German measles (rubella) than to risk further brain damage or death. Immunizations are not universally harmless - odds that something adverse will happen are more likely than winning the 649. Whooping cough (pertussis) immunization would kill our child. I am sure you are not advocating that.

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Obviously if the vaccine is going to kill the kid, then we are in a different situation.

But the cold reality of it is that if one in a million kids need to die in order to save the thousands that die of these illnesses, then its not so bad of a trade off, from society's perspective.

If the doctor says its too dangerous to give a kid a shot, then fine don't give the shot. But if you just choose not to, your commiting an crime against everyone in society.

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But the cold reality of it is that if one in a million kids need to die in order to save the thousands that die of these illnesses, then its not so bad of a trade off, from society's perspective.
There is no way you could force me to vaccinate my kid if I had a family member that went through Canuck's experience. The odds of a bad reaction probably go up significantly if you know a genetically related person had a bad reaction. Do you have kids Geoffry? If you don''t then you probably can't understand why most parents consider the life of their child more important than the lives of 1000's of others. Even a parent who is willing to sacrifice their own life for the 'greater good' would never make that same choice for their own child.

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They've also decided not to give the child milk...

Calcium deficiency, anyone???

Milk is not the only natural source of calcium.

The more and more shots we end up taking, I think, the more our immune system will eventually fail us. Take a shot to combat or prevent some ailment. Sounds good to me right? It can have the adverse affect of our immune system taking a nice holiday because of the shots. Your body ends up reliying on those shots to ward off illnesses. Why is it we have more desieses today than we did 100 years ago? Any why do we have 4 different products to choose from when shopping for the right medication?

I do not approve of these mandatory shots.

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As for food, let's face it...soon practically all the foods we eat will be tampered with. There will be no such thing as "natural" food in the near future. "Organic" is in question. Though pesticides and/or chemicals are not being used....how do you control the ones that come down with rain and seep to the ground?

Franken-food is unstoppable....unless you grow and raise your own. Even then, where do you get the seeds, the calf, the chick?

I am leery of fresh vegetables that looks "fresh" for weeks! It's common to encounter asparagus...or broccoli that have that firm, green look....until days later, you feel certain parts mushy, and yet they still look green! What chemicals make them last that long?

I say your body system needs to evolve with the way our food is evolving. It's the only way to build up natural "immunity" against these types. Whether you like it or not, you'll be facing and consuming these foods. That's one reason why I still drink tap water.

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But the cold reality of it is that if one in a million kids need to die in order to save the thousands that die of these illnesses, then its not so bad of a trade off, from society's perspective.
There is no way you could force me to vaccinate my kid if I had a family member that went through Canuck's experience. The odds of a bad reaction probably go up significantly if you know a genetically related person had a bad reaction. Do you have kids Geoffry? If you don''t then you probably can't understand why most parents consider the life of their child more important than the lives of 1000's of others. Even a parent who is willing to sacrifice their own life for the 'greater good' would never make that same choice for their own child.

Like I said, if the kid is going to have a reaction then no, they wouldn't be forced.

Allergies aren't genetic.

Milk is not the only natural source of calcium.

Enlighten me please, what non-milk product has calcium??

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Like I said, if the kid is going to have a reaction then no, they wouldn't be forced. Allergies aren't genetic.
I don't think a vaccine reaction is an allergy and I am pretty sure scientists have no idea why some people react differently. If they did they could test people in advance.
Enlighten me please, what non-milk product has calcium??
Dairy foods Milk, yogurt, cheese

Leafy green vegetables Broccoli, kale, spinach

Fruits Oranges

Beans and peas Tofu, peanuts, peas, black beans, baked beans

Fish Salmon, sardines

Any kind of seaweed (i.e. the wraps on sushi rolls).

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Actually most vaccine reactions are allergies, what other reaction would they be? Normally, its an allergy to an ingredient in the mix.

Broccoli has calcium? Oranges? Unbelievable. Never would have known.

I knew about Salmon, but you have to eat the little bones to get the calcium, and who does that? I'm guessing you'd have to eat about 600 pounds of oranges a day to meet the equivlent of milk in your diet, but oh well.

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