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I'm not certain how Iran and Israel would fight a war except by proxy. Israel invaded Lebanon in 1982 and occupied the entire south of the country including part of Beirut. This did not provoke a general war between Syria and Israel.

The IDF is dealing with Hamas and Hizballah. The better question to ask is what options do they have.

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I'm not certain how Iran and Israel would fight a war except by proxy. Israel invaded Lebanon in 1982 and occupied the entire south of the country including part of Beirut. This did not provoke a general war between Syria and Israel.

The IDF is dealing with Hamas and Hizballah. The better question to ask is what options do they have.

This morning, the Israeli prime minister warned Iran and Syria that if the kidnapped Israeli soldiers ended up in either country, that Israel would respond. I don't know if that would be a proxy war then.

It's a big if to be sure about Iran but it isn't beyond the realm of possibility that Syria might somehow get involved.

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I'm not certain how Iran and Israel would fight a war except by proxy. Israel invaded Lebanon in 1982 and occupied the entire south of the country including part of Beirut. This did not provoke a general war between Syria and Israel.

The IDF is dealing with Hamas and Hizballah. The better question to ask is what options do they have.

This morning, the Israeli prime minister warned Iran and Syria that if the kidnapped Israeli soldiers ended up in either country, that Israel would respond. I don't know if that would be a proxy war then.

It's a big if to be sure about Iran but it isn't beyond the realm of possibility that Syria might somehow get involved.

I think this is offering Israel the perfect opportunity to strike Iran's nuke sites. I think it's time to clean house a little.

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IMR,

I think this is offering Israel the perfect opportunity to strike Iran's nuke sites. I think it's time to clean house a little.
Iran has signed a treaty to defend Syria, should Syria be attacked by Israel. Israel would be prudent to attack Syria, drawing Iran into an action. Then, Israel wouldn't look like it was launching a 'first strike' (or purposely attacking another Islamic country) but rather defending itself. All of these things would require meticulous measurement, though.

Interestingly,

from...

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/lib...60714-voa02.htm

But Saudi Arabia lashed out against what it called "rash adventures" by elements inside Lebanon without legitimate authority or coordination with Arab countries.
Is Saudi Arabia 'pulling the strings', and is chastizing Hizbollah for not following orders?

from...

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/lib...60714-voa01.htm

Lebanon's government has requested the U.N. Security council to implement an immediate cease-fire in the region. Lebanese officials insist they had no prior knowledge of and did not condone the attack by Hezbollah guerrillas on Wednesday.

On Thursday the United States vetoed a United Nations resolution demanding that Israel halt attacks in Lebanon, but U.S. officials also urged Israel to show restraint in defending itself.

This is a toughie. Is Ohlmert ready to play for 'all or none'?

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This morning, the Israeli prime minister warned Iran and Syria that if the kidnapped Israeli soldiers ended up in either country, that Israel would respond. I don't know if that would be a proxy war then.
I suppose. They could start trading missiles. Israel may have the ability to overfly parts of Iran but I don't know if the Iranian air force has a similar ability over Israel.
I think this is offering Israel the perfect opportunity to strike Iran's nuke sites. I think it's time to clean house a little.
Maybe.

Harper is on about releasing the three soldiers and certainly the Israelis themselves deal harshly with hostage-taking. Israel's main preoccupation is with Hamas and Hizballah and they are the ones now urgently examining their options.

Israel invaded Lebanon in 1982 to rid Lebanon of the PLO. Maybe its intent now is to do the same with Hizballah. That would be a proxy war with Iran. Dunno.

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This morning, the Israeli prime minister warned Iran and Syria that if the kidnapped Israeli soldiers ended up in either country, that Israel would respond. I don't know if that would be a proxy war then.

I suppose. They could start trading missiles. Israel may have the ability to overfly parts of Iran but I don't know if the Iranian air force has a similar ability over Israel.

Most analysts say Iran's fleet of aircraft is not capable of making it to Israel and back. Israel is capable of doing it but only if other Arab countries are not looking to shoot them down.

They both have missiles capable of hitting each other. Iran has less directional control but they do have multiple warheads and possibly chemical and biological weapons.

Both sides may be reluctant to go to that extreme since Israel's response would be a tactical nuclear strike to any chemical or biological attack.

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August most military journals and intelligence reports you can read over the web-site seem to indicate Iran's air-force cxonsists of fighter jets left over from the Shah's era given by the Americans or Russian MIGS but there have been no spare parts used to up-date this rusting equipment nor does Iran appear to have the technological ability to fix its planes or engage in an air war. If Israeli jets could over-fly into Iran they would have to do so by flying over Jordan and Iraq.

Syria's air force also consists of aged MIGS whose parts have not ben up-dated so they have no real air foce.

The Syrian Army is poorly fed and has no real logistics support. It is in fact a rag tag army. Its elite unit is its secret police and they have had a tendency to be the first to skip out and avoid war.

Iran's ground army is full of manpower but has little in the way of logistics, i.e., fresh water, food and equipment. It has scud missiles which are unreliable, some missiles rumoured to have been obtained from China and North Korea, definitely toxic chemical war-fare capabilities, but in reality no delivery system to get its foot soldiers out of the country.

The reality is if there was a war, it would be a quick air war and I strongly doubt Israel would send anything on the ground into Syria or Iran. Yes Israel would probably knock out some suspected nuclear sites but anyone who knows anything about air strikes knows they are at the best of times hit and miss.

If Israel engages in a direct skirmish with Syria it would happen in Lebanon. Syria has a poor reputation fighting for more then a few days on the ground and do not under-estimate many Lebanese as much as they hate Israel equally hate the Syrians and still do not forgive them for killing their leader.

I think the realistic scenario is a limited tactical strike or series of strikes by Israeli missiles from helicopters and perhaps their F-16 fleet and controlled artillery bombardments and possible commando strikes or spot assassinations but I do not see there being a conventional war.

Also do not under-estimate the Russian influence on Israel behind the scenes these days. Russia and Turkey secretly have entered into a military alliance with Israel and are supplying Israel oil and Putin is no dummy, he will exert his influence. In a way these days, Russia has as much if not more influence over Israel then the US does. In fact contrary to popular opinion, the US foreign policy is at logger heads with Israel and would be completely against any conventional wars. The support Bush gives to Israel against terrorism should not be confused with the behind the scenes American concern that an all-out war would de-destablizie the region and increase oil prices which would have a detrimental effect on the US economy.

Its a mess.

The fact is Israel has very limited options and it will use them and do what it has been doing emphasizing strategic assassinations and as much as possible pin point precision attacks.

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Best plan for Israel;

Give 72 hours notice to deliver the three citizens or face the forced evacuation of the West Bank and the destruction of Gaza.

If the citizens are not returned within 72 hours, clean out the West Bank and level Gaza with artillery. The next day call a media meeting to watch bulldozers puch the rubble of Gaza into the sea. Build a nice little park on the newly created land and put a memorial on it with an epitaph.

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What options are left for Israel in the conflict? Is war inevitable with Syria and Iran by next week?

It all starts with Palestine. The Hezbollah thing is a mere side-show, though it does open interesting possibilities of tugging Syria and possibly Iran in so the Israelis would have some cover to strike at Iran's nuclear facilities. I wouldn't be surprised if there were a lot of high level people in Israel and the US who would see this as a great opportunity to push back Iran's nuclear aspirations for another decade or so.

Realistically, Palestine is no more. It's idiotic to want to bring a Palestinian state into existence in two tiny parcels of arid land. What was Palestine is now largely made up of Jordan and Israel. The only sensible thing to do is give Gaza to Egypt and make the inhabitants Egyptian citizens, and for Jordan to absord the remainder of Palestine and give them citizenship. The Americans need to spread a lot of bribe money around Jordan and Egypt. I don't know what the local feeling is on this, though. I doubt it's a popular idea but since when has the opinion of the man on the street been of any consideration in that part of the world?

In the short term, Israel needs to continue to make it clear to the Palestinians that life is going to be hell for them as long as they continue to attack Israel. I think, frankly, they're being too gentle. They should destroy all electricity production in Gaza, smash their roads, destroy irrigation systems, sewers, etc.

As for Lebanon, the Israelis are already putting out that message pretty strongly.

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This problem will not be solved until the Palestinian question has an answer. The only viable option is to provide free choice to affected citizens. The only choice they have is war or peace. If it is peace, then well and good. If it is war, then an end is near to their plight. But they, like any other people deserve a choice. It is simple really, just have Israel offer to move the citizens out who wish to live in peace. Those who wish to fight can stay and live or die until the war is over. But give the civilians, the citizens, a choice.

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Also do not under-estimate the Russian influence on Israel behind the scenes these days. Russia and Turkey secretly have entered into a military alliance with Israel and are supplying Israel oil and Putin is no dummy, he will exert his influence. In a way these days, Russia has as much if not more influence over Israel then the US does.

I hope you can back that up with some evidence, this is the first time I hear of it.

In fact contrary to popular opinion, the US foreign policy is at logger heads with Israel and would be completely against any conventional wars.

The largest supplier of arms to Israel is the U.S.A. A good deal of weapons and craft for the Army, airforce and navy have come from the US or been designed by US corps. The more Israel uses, the more they will get. For the companies in the US are making money from it. Not like they are going to stop that anytime soon.

Isreal is the only major power in the middle east. That was no accident.

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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13875121/

It has been reported that Iranian soldiers fired the missile in Lebanon that killed Israeli sailors.

I think we can expect an attack on Iran in the next two days.

I think restraint is needed there. I really really really doubt Iran had anything to do with this whole showdown. They have only gave support to Syria if they have been attacked. Iran will not make a push.

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Also do not under-estimate the Russian influence on Israel behind the scenes these days. Russia and Turkey secretly have entered into a military alliance with Israel and are supplying Israel oil and Putin is no dummy, he will exert his influence. In a way these days, Russia has as much if not more influence over Israel then the US does.

I hope you can back that up with some evidence, this is the first time I hear of it.

In fact contrary to popular opinion, the US foreign policy is at logger heads with Israel and would be completely against any conventional wars.

The largest supplier of arms to Israel is the U.S.A. A good deal of weapons and craft for the Army, airforce and navy have come from the US or been designed by US corps. The more Israel uses, the more they will get. For the companies in the US are making money from it. Not like they are going to stop that anytime soon.

Isreal is the only major power in the middle east. That was no accident.

You really should read up on military journals. The US is the major military supplier not just for Israel but Egypt, Saudia Arabia, Kuwait, The United Arab Emirates, Pakistan. The United States, Russia, France, Britain, Belgium, Germany, China, North Korea, all sell weapons in the Middle East. France supplies military, chemical, nuclear and industrial technology to Iran and every Middle East country. Britain seems to be doing quite well with Libya and Jordan. The French have always been the military suppliers to all French speaking Arab countries, i.e., Morrocco, Algeria and Tunisia.

Look and you will find that it is a misnomer to simply state Israel is supplied by the U.S. 90% of the U.S. economy is related to its military industrial complex and the same can be said of France.

In fact Israel has an internal ability to build its own weapons. While it uses US military for patriot missiles and its air fighter fleet it also manufactures its own fighter jets (Kfirs) that are right now the best in the world, and it pretty much rebuilds all its navy vessels.

In fact Israel has military alliances with India, Turkey and Russia as well which are not broadcast and it still maintains a military development relationship with certain African nations.

There is a popular misconception that Israel is completely dependent on the U.S. Understand how internal military suppliers work. If the US for any reason could not supply Israel within seconds, military salesman from many nations would be lining up to sell.

The biggest whores when it comes to military sales are the Chinese, North Koreans, Belgians, French, Germans, Russians and Americans.

The US simply does what other countries do. They play the feuding parties against each other, and sell both sides weapons. Don't kid yourself when it comes to military supplies, the US and these other nations will sell to anyone.

As for Canada we have no problems selling nuclear reactors to ANYONE. We have no problems with China and at the peak of Cucescu's bloody facistic rule of Romania we had no problem selling him Candu reactors.

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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13875121/

It has been reported that Iranian soldiers fired the missile in Lebanon that killed Israeli sailors.

I think we can expect an attack on Iran in the next two days.

I think restraint is needed there. I really really really doubt Iran had anything to do with this whole showdown. They have only gave support to Syria if they have been attacked. Iran will not make a push.

They are just saying on the news now that Iranian troops are being seen with Hezbolla. If this is the case, then Iran most likely will be targeted.

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I don't condone Hezbollah or Hamas, in fact, I solely hold these terrorists responsible for what is happening currently.

But doesn't anyone get the impression that this is the global equivlent of the kid that fires an elastic in class and the response from the person hit is to kill everyone in the class?

Israel's response is irresponsible, unmeasured and completely not proportional. They are only hurting themselves in the long run, and definitely losing the moral high ground. Blowing up roadways and airports, and threats saying that we are going to "set back Lebanon's infrastructure 10 years" are just so crude and barbaric.

Your average Lebanese person has no stake in this conflict, but they are the most likely to be hurt by this violence. Remember, Hezbollah is only 14 (of 128) Seats in the Lebanese Parliment. Nearly half their population is Christian too. This whole blaming Lebanon thing for the actions of Hezbollah is just so beyond ridiculous.

This isn't Palestine where they've chosen terrorism over peace, democratically. Lebanon is struggling to improve their way of life, and now Israel wants to intentionally attack infrastructure that will improvrish the nation forever again.

It's disgusting.

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I don't condone Hezbollah or Hamas, in fact, I solely hold these terrorists responsible for what is happening currently.

Wow. Those of us who hold to a culture of personal responsibilty tend to be less generous. I blame every member of Hezbollah and Hamas from bottom to top, the civilian populations which support them, the nations which provide money and encouragement, and the governments which pretend to hold sovereignty over a given area but then shrug and say they can do nothing about terrorists attacking their neighbours.

But doesn't anyone get the impression that this is the global equivlent of the kid that fires an elastic in class and the response from the person hit is to kill everyone in the class?

Suppose you go to Israel and tell the mothers of the young soldiers killed during those kidnappings that, hey, it was nothing but a rubber band, and they shouldn't get so upset.

Israel's response is irresponsible, unmeasured and completely not proportional.

Complete and utter drivel. Israel did what everyone insisted, and left Gaza, left Lebanon. The locals took this as an opportunity to move closer to Israel's borders and fire rockets, mortars and other missiles at Israeli towns and cities. Hezbollah has fired hundreds of missiles into Israel since Israel vacated Lebanon, and now has attacked Israel, killed its soldiers, and kidnapped others. What do you want the Israelis to do? File a protest with the United Nations??!

As for "proportionate", just where did you get the idiotic idea that Israel has to respond only in the exact same way? It's like telling the cops that it's unfair to send fifty SWAT guys after a man who kills a cop with a shotgun. Oh, how lacking in proportion they are! How unfair that they're using so many cops against this poor, outnumbered murderer!

They are only hurting themselves in the long run, and definitely losing the moral high ground. Blowing up roadways and airports, and threats saying that we are going to "set back Lebanon's infrastructure 10 years" are just so crude and barbaric.

Bullshit. What Israel is doing is showing the Lebanese that if they want to support a terrorist group and have that group continually attacking Israel, they're going to pay the price for it. ANY other nation on earth, including this one, would do the same. And if the Israelis have to reduce Lebanon and Gaza to the stone age, with its people living in mud huts without electricity or running water in order to persuade them it's a bad idea to keep firing missiles at Israeli cities then they should go for it. Moral high ground? What utter twaddle!

Israel doesn't give a crap about the tender feelings of lilly white bleeding heart liberals who have never known danger, and who would piss themselves and run screaming in terror if it ever approached. Israel has come to learn the only time such people will show it sympathy is when vast numbers of Jews are killed - and only then the sympathy will only last so long as Israel does not take any revenge, for the only good Jew is a quiet, peaceful, submissive Jew who takes his punishment as he should.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself. John Stuart Mill

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IMR,
I think this is offering Israel the perfect opportunity to strike Iran's nuke sites. I think it's time to clean house a little.
Iran has signed a treaty to defend Syria, should Syria be attacked by Israel. Israel would be prudent to attack Syria, drawing Iran into an action. Then, Israel wouldn't look like it was launching a 'first strike' (or purposely attacking another Islamic country) but rather defending itself. All of these things would require meticulous measurement, though.

Interestingly,

from...

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/lib...60714-voa02.htm

But Saudi Arabia lashed out against what it called "rash adventures" by elements inside Lebanon without legitimate authority or coordination with Arab countries.
Is Saudi Arabia 'pulling the strings', and is chastizing Hizbollah for not following orders?

from...

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/lib...60714-voa01.htm

Lebanon's government has requested the U.N. Security council to implement an immediate cease-fire in the region. Lebanese officials insist they had no prior knowledge of and did not condone the attack by Hezbollah guerrillas on Wednesday.

On Thursday the United States vetoed a United Nations resolution demanding that Israel halt attacks in Lebanon, but U.S. officials also urged Israel to show restraint in defending itself.

This is a toughie. Is Ohlmert ready to play for 'all or none'?

Interesting...

I'm not sure Ohlmert is the man for the job. Enough is enough with all of this stuff though. We need some closure here. I get annoyed about the call for cease fires by the UN. It seems it's always just a temporary fix. The passifists of the world seem to be able to stomach a little bit of killing here and there even if it lasts for 50 years. I'd prefer for them to have it out and get it over with. Establish a Palestinian state and build the biggest fortified wall possible. Thoughts on the wall Thelonius?

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IMR,

I'm not sure Ohlmert is the man for the job.
He has certainly 'taken the gloves off', but a 'go for the throat while kicking for the nuts' kind of guy has to be Uzi Landau. Things would have to look bad for Israel before anyone would put him in charge, though.
We need some closure here. I get annoyed about the call for cease fires by the UN. It seems it's always just a temporary fix. The passifists of the world seem to be able to stomach a little bit of killing here and there even if it lasts for 50 years. I'd prefer for them to have it out and get it over with.
I agree, not much different killing thousands of people over a 50 year span or a 50 day one, they are still just as dead. 'Having it out' might change 'bloodletting' into lots of bloodshed, but if a workable and long term peace can come from it, then I agree...get on with it.
Establish a Palestinian state and build the biggest fortified wall possible
Been tried, doesn't solve the problem. Either the Arabs accept Israel (in which case they wouldn't need the wall) or they won't, which seems more likely.
Thoughts on the wall Thelonius?
Ah yes, I see some trouble ahead. Israel cannot 'clean house' in the Middle East without help, they simply haven't the resources without going nuke, or having the US (and possibly a lot of others) firmly on board. That would mean a showdown with Islam. However, I think that is coming.

Countries like Saudi Arabia need to be confronted or cut loose from their cozy, yet Janus-faced relationship with the 'West'. The US can't turn a blind eye to state sponsors of terrorism for favourable economic reasons much longer.

I think either all world religions must sit down and talk over their differences, divide up regions according to religious preferences and keep them segregated, or fight it out. I think the latter is far more likely to happen, so it should be prepared for with the utmost of urgency. In short, I fear open war with Islamic nations, and therefore Islam, is going to happen. We can choose the time or wait for it.

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I hope you folks understand that this has nothing to do with Canada, and it is something we should stay the hell away from. The United States has some very serious friendships that come with obligations over there but we do not.

This could end up being a lot worse than we currently think folks. We literally can't do anything for anybody over there because we simply don't have either the hardware or the manpower to do it.

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I hope you folks understand that this has nothing to do with Canada, and it is something we should stay the hell away from.
Too late for that.
This could end up being a lot worse than we currently think folks. We literally can't do anything for anybody over there because we simply don't have either the hardware or the manpower to do it.
If 'the lights go out and the balloon goes up', you'll fight with your teeth and nails, like it or not. It's possible that 'manpower' would be a token gesture, and what will be needed is 'every man, woman and childpower', and still the outcome might be in doubt.

Just tryin' to keep thinking happy thoughts.

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Also do not under-estimate the Russian influence on Israel behind the scenes these days. Russia and Turkey secretly have entered into a military alliance with Israel and are supplying Israel oil and Putin is no dummy, he will exert his influence. In a way these days, Russia has as much if not more influence over Israel then the US does.

I hope you can back that up with some evidence, this is the first time I hear of it.

In fact contrary to popular opinion, the US foreign policy is at logger heads with Israel and would be completely against any conventional wars.

The largest supplier of arms to Israel is the U.S.A. A good deal of weapons and craft for the Army, airforce and navy have come from the US or been designed by US corps. The more Israel uses, the more they will get. For the companies in the US are making money from it. Not like they are going to stop that anytime soon.

Isreal is the only major power in the middle east. That was no accident.

You really should read up on military journals. The US is the major military supplier not just for Israel but Egypt, Saudia Arabia, Kuwait, The United Arab Emirates, Pakistan. The United States, Russia, France, Britain, Belgium, Germany, China, North Korea, all sell weapons in the Middle East. France supplies military, chemical, nuclear and industrial technology to Iran and every Middle East country. Britain seems to be doing quite well with Libya and Jordan. The French have always been the military suppliers to all French speaking Arab countries, i.e., Morrocco, Algeria and Tunisia.

Look and you will find that it is a misnomer to simply state Israel is supplied by the U.S. 90% of the U.S. economy is related to its military industrial complex and the same can be said of France.

In fact Israel has an internal ability to build its own weapons. While it uses US military for patriot missiles and its air fighter fleet it also manufactures its own fighter jets (Kfirs) that are right now the best in the world, and it pretty much rebuilds all its navy vessels.

In fact Israel has military alliances with India, Turkey and Russia as well which are not broadcast and it still maintains a military development relationship with certain African nations.

There is a popular misconception that Israel is completely dependent on the U.S. Understand how internal military suppliers work. If the US for any reason could not supply Israel within seconds, military salesman from many nations would be lining up to sell.

The biggest whores when it comes to military sales are the Chinese, North Koreans, Belgians, French, Germans, Russians and Americans.

The US simply does what other countries do. They play the feuding parties against each other, and sell both sides weapons. Don't kid yourself when it comes to military supplies, the US and these other nations will sell to anyone.

As for Canada we have no problems selling nuclear reactors to ANYONE. We have no problems with China and at the peak of Cucescu's bloody facistic rule of Romania we had no problem selling him Candu reactors.

France and Russia are the worst hypocrits because they feign outrage over Israel's response to both Hamas and Hezbollah's attacks on Israel, yet they sell weapins to these terrorist groups, and their sponsor countries like Syria, and Iran. Let not forget North Korea either because both France, Germany, Russia and Begium all sell to this dictatorship. It seems if France, Russia and Germany had their way Israel would not have the right to defend themselves. Thank God that Israel has the might to defend themselves from Hamas, Hezbollah and rogue states like Syria, Lebanon, and Iran.

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Wow. Those of us who hold to a culture of personal responsibilty tend to be less generous. I blame every member of Hezbollah and Hamas from bottom to top, the civilian populations which support them, the nations which provide money and encouragement, and the governments which pretend to hold sovereignty over a given area but then shrug and say they can do nothing about terrorists attacking their neighbours.

Lebanon doesn't give popular support to Hezbollah, like I said only 14 of 128 seats are held by these terrorists. 11% of people in Lebanon want violence apparently, I bet popular support for the FLQ was higher than that at times in Quebec, no calls to wipe all Quebecois off the map and destroy all Quebec infrastructure were heard.

Suppose you go to Israel and tell the mothers of the young soldiers killed during those kidnappings that, hey, it was nothing but a rubber band, and they shouldn't get so upset.

Gladly. They are soldiers, I'm more comfortable with them being kidnapped than 6 year old children being bombed as they sleep. Big difference. What do you think the ratio of deaths is at now? 100:1? What ratio is acceptable to you, how much more is a Jew worth than an Arab? Are you comfortable telling the uninvolved Lebanese woman that her kids need to die to avenge Israeli kidnapped soldiers?

Complete and utter drivel. Israel did what everyone insisted, and left Gaza, left Lebanon. The locals took this as an opportunity to move closer to Israel's borders and fire rockets, mortars and other missiles at Israeli towns and cities. Hezbollah has fired hundreds of missiles into Israel since Israel vacated Lebanon, and now has attacked Israel, killed its soldiers, and kidnapped others. What do you want the Israelis to do? File a protest with the United Nations??!

Take out the missles, kill/round up the terrorists, enforce stricter border controls, ect. ect.. That'd be acceptable.

As for "proportionate", just where did you get the idiotic idea that Israel has to respond only in the exact same way? It's like telling the cops that it's unfair to send fifty SWAT guys after a man who kills a cop with a shotgun. Oh, how lacking in proportion they are! How unfair that they're using so many cops against this poor, outnumbered murderer!

They don't have to respond in the exact same way. But bombing a country back 10 years in infrastructure, which will obviously impact millions that have no stake in the conflict, is quite the difference then a few kidnapped soldiers.

Your missing the fact that most Lebanese people don't support Hezbollah or violence against Israel. They vote for progressive parties and not terrorists. If you were talking about Palestine, where they want terrorism, then I take your side.

Bullshit. What Israel is doing is showing the Lebanese that if they want to support a terrorist group and have that group continually attacking Israel, they're going to pay the price for it. ANY other nation on earth, including this one, would do the same. And if the Israelis have to reduce Lebanon and Gaza to the stone age, with its people living in mud huts without electricity or running water in order to persuade them it's a bad idea to keep firing missiles at Israeli cities then they should go for it. Moral high ground? What utter twaddle!

See above. There is little popular support for Hezbollah in Lebanon. Their success with destroying everything and making people improverished hasn't shown any real results over the years either.

Israel doesn't give a crap about the tender feelings of lilly white bleeding heart liberals who have never known danger, and who would piss themselves and run screaming in terror if it ever approached. Israel has come to learn the only time such people will show it sympathy is when vast numbers of Jews are killed - and only then the sympathy will only last so long as Israel does not take any revenge, for the only good Jew is a quiet, peaceful, submissive Jew who takes his punishment as he should.

Have you ever served abroad Argus? I sure hope so, otherwise you look like a massive idiot lecturing me about not knowing real danger, you hear alot of that speak from the chickenhawks. Either way, revenge killing should have died out with the stone age, it's barbaric and ridiculous.

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I hope you folks understand that this has nothing to do with Canada, and it is something we should stay the hell away from. The United States has some very serious friendships that come with obligations over there but we do not.

This could end up being a lot worse than we currently think folks. We literally can't do anything for anybody over there because we simply don't have either the hardware or the manpower to do it.

That might not help us if Bush asks us to get involved later on somehow, someway.

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